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Live Blogging from the Democratic Debate
April 16, 2008 8:52 PM
9:50 pm ET: Apologies for drop-off in postings as the debate wore on -- the overwhelming number of comments slowed down our server.
Overall -- with the preface that all of this may not matter, since Obama was and is the delegate leader, this was not a good night for the frontrunner. He hasn't been all that strong in any of the debates, and we saw some of his less attractive qualities tonight -- odd comparisons (Ayers and Tom Coburn?), some slippery answers, and a general prediliction to avoid confronting his own words and actions directly.
Clinton had one of her better nights -- set a generally positive tone, despite the need for her to score some points. She managed to avoid overt attacks but still found ways to differentiate herself -- and make herself look presidential.
Bottom line: I don't think Sen. Obama got this much scrutiny in any other two-hour period during this campaign, but then again he shouldn't have been surprised by any of the lines of inquiry. I'm not sure he held up that well -- not that he fell apart, but he didn't do himself all too many favors. There are a number of answers I think he'd like to have back. But for his supporters -- the soaring above his opponent is almost certainly attractive.
That's it for tonight -- check back in tomorrow morning in The Note for a full wrap and analysis.
9:34 pm ET: The handwriting wasn't his? From a Politico story unearthed by ABC's Teddy Davis: "Through an aide, Obama, who won the group’s endorsement as well as the statehouse seat, did not dispute that the handwriting was his."
9:28 pm ET: How does Sen. Obama not have a position on the DC gun ban? It's not like this is a new issue --and, as he likes to say, he taught constitutional law.
9:26 pm ET: A much different Clinton we're hearing tonight on guns, in Philadelphia, with Virginia Tech as backdrop.
9:22 pm ET: So far, it's hard to score for Obama. He's gotten tougher questions, but sometimes hasn't seemed like he saw them coming. And Clinton is back to the strong presence we saw early in the cycle, when she was the frontrunner.
9:19 pm ET: A Republican strategist offers this, to ABC's Karen Travers: "I think we’re going to buy 90 minute infomercials in October to replay this . . . I can’t believe Obama’s answer on Ayers. It’s like he never even considered the question. Doesn’t he do debate prep?! His answer was so bad/wrong/misleading/offensive – it’s going to be a huge problem for him . . ."
9:15 pm ET: Obama is trying to skate around his plans on the Social Security payroll tax. Gibson is right, lots of people make between $97,000 and $250,000, and their taxes would go up. Nobody wants to favor a tax hike, but Obama may be ceding the high ground of intellectual honesty by not calling this was it is.
9:09 pm ET: Obama, on capital gains -- strikes me as a strong answer, lots of juicy morsels of economic populism.
And when Clinton gets the question, she didn't answer directly. That comes through.
9:04 pm ET: On taxes, Clinton is clear about letting the tax cuts for wealthy earners expire. And "I am absolutely committed to not raising taxes on middle-class Americans." (Which she defines as people making under $250,000? That's a thick middle...)
Oh -- and go to that Website (and maybe make a donation while you're there).
9 pm ET: Israel is a potentially dicey issue for Obama -- he just spent this morning explaining himself to Jewish leaders in Philadelphia. Seems like he gave the "right" answer for that constituency.
8:56 pm ET: On troop withdrawal -- Clinton's answer leaves a teensy bit of daylight, no? She's still going to consult with military commanders, right? Not that that's irresponsible, but it isn't entirely consistent with the idea of definitely sticking to a withdrawal plan.
8:48 pm ET: Strikes me as an Obama performance that his backers will adore -- but not one that's going to do him much good in terms of quelling concerns about his candidacy. Again, thinking of the undecided superdelegates -- if they're watching tonight, I don't see them tipping based on this performance, not so far.
8:45 pm ET: Obama swings back on the "weather underground" connections -- brings up pardons. (!) That was his first flash of offense tonight.
8:43 pm ET: Clinton has the facts on the Ayers relationship. Taken as a whole, not a great first 43 minutes of the evening. "What they did was set bombs," Clinton said.
8:38 pm ET: Obama on the flag question: "I revere the American flag, and I would not be running for president if I did not revere this country." And he "shows" patriotism through actions, not symbols. That's a solid answer -- not that the questions will stop.
8:34 pm ET: A sharp colleague notes that Sen. Obama has not used the word "hope" yet tonight -- think that's right, will check the transcript to be sure [actually -- he did in his open, but not since]. Is Sen. Clinton the candidate of "hope" this evening?
8:33 pm ET: Maybe it doesn't help her, but Sen. Clinton is falling on her sword over her big recent mistake, on Bosnia.
8:30 pm ET: Obama is not really directly engaging on the questions of his own behavior and language. A little curious. There's a lot of talk about uniting and rising above, but does that assuage concerns? (And he came perilously close to saying he "disowned" Rev. Wright.
8:27 pm ET: Per ABC's Teddy Davis, these are the comments in Rolling Stone that Obama WAS aware of -- the ones he described as "entirely different": "We believe in white supremacy and black inferiority and believe it more than we believe in God. . . . We conducted radiation experiments on our own people. . . . We care nothing about human life if the ends justify the means!"
8:26 pm ET: Strikes me as a ho-hum answer on Rev. Wright -- something's still missing. Obviously he was concerned enough about Wright to disinvite him from his announcement ceremony, yet it wasn't until it went to YouTube that he grew really concerned? He tries to rise above this one, too, but again, the comments linger.
I'm just a bit surprised he didn't have a sharper answer on this, and the "bitter" remark. "When we are unified, there is nothing we cannot tackle," Obama said in closing. What, exactly, does that have to do with his relationship with Rev. Wright?
8:21 pm ET: I've already lost track of how many times Sen. Clinton has made this about the Democratic Party as a whole. This is shades of early-debate Clintons, when she rose above the field. Myrtle Beach Clinton hasn't shown up yet.
8:19 pm ET: This has become the Obama M.O. -- when attacked, push back by ascribing it to the old kind of politics. Works with his base, but beyond that? The comments in question linger. He didn't have much to say that's new tonight on the "bitter" comment, for better or worse.
8:16 pm ET: Clinton is asked -- can Obama beat John McCain: "I think we have to beat John McCain." Hmmmm -- what was missing there? BUT, when pressed: "Yes, yes, yes. I think that I can do do a better job."
This is not the bazooka approach. Too much risk of backfire?
8:15 pm ET: Clinton reminds us of her PA roots -- and focuses on the "cling" part of the remark, of course. "I just don't believe that's how people live their lives." "I can see why people would be taken aback and offended by the remarks." And -- perhaps oddly -- this debate has Sen. Clinton offering a touch more of hope.
8:12 pm ET: Obama on "bitter": "There's no doubt that I can see why people are offended." He's clearly had time to prepare his answers on this (indeed, he's had answers on this every day since Friday). Yet he's still not fully addressing his sentiments -- focusing on what he can explain away, versus what he can't (namely, the "clinging" to guns, religion, anti-immigrant sentiments). If the comment is remembered just as about "bitterness," Obama can survive this and thrive through it -- people ARE bitter.
8:10 pm ET: Sen. Clinton aims for healing -- will do whatever she can to see the Democrat elected, "anywhere in the country." (She doesn't want to answer, either.) Wonder if this is Clinton working on her negative numbers -- her first answer, on the dream ticket, is about party healing, and a strong promise to campaign for Obama if he's the nominee.
8:08 pm ET: Ahhh, the dream ticket question: Looong pause there. Sen. Obama jumps in: "Premature," he says. (Yes, but that's the point of the Cuomo proposal.) Sorry, but he doesn't want to answer the simple, "why not?" (That's a complicated answer, now isn't it, Sen. Obama?)
8:05 pm ET: Clinton uses her opening statement to talk about "records" and "plans" -- plus a shout-out for her Website (still working on that donors list).
8:03 pm ET: In his opening statement, Obama immediately turns to the "frustration" of Pennsylvanians -- he's trying to own the sentiment of his "bitter" comment before it owns him.
For those asking, the debate will be streaming live on the Website of our ABC affiliate in Philadelphia, WPVI.
7:55 pm ET: Funny moment during the awkward silence after the mic checks but before the debate started. Playing off the "We the people" banners that are ubiquitous inside the Constitution Center, Charlie Gibson said, "In here, it's we the contributors." Said Obama: "Just like Washington." (Some groans.)
7:51 pm ET: The senators are coming onto the stage now. It will be Clinton stage right, Obama stage left. The podiums are pretty close to each other -- should make the tussles fun.
7:06 pm ET: If you're Sen. Clinton, how do you frame your attacks (assuming you attack tonight)? Her problem is with credibility -- so she has to come with hard and fast facts, not just talk, in making her case.
And keep in mind tonight -- no matter what happens in Pennsylvania, it will be the superdelegates who are likely to settle this race. So they will be the other audience -- a more politically savvy crew, though also a difficult group to reach.
6:35 pm ET: Another name for the celebrity-watch: M. Night Shyamalan. (Does he see dead candidates?)
6:23 pm ET: For those asking, the debate will be streaming live on the Website of our ABC affiliate in Philadelphia, WPVI.
Greetings from Philadelphia's Constitution Center. Rick Klein from ABC's The Note here -- I'm live blogging during tonight's debate, which airs on ABC starting at 8 pm ET.
For you star-watchers, tonight's (cozy) crowd of 573 will include: Ted Danson, Richard Dreyfuss, and Harvey Weinstein, in addition to famous-for-politics folks including Chelsea Clinton, Wes Clark, Gov. Jon Corzine, Gov. Ed Rendell, and Philadelphia Mayor Michael Nutter. Bill Clinton will not be in attendance. Stephen Colbert wants in -- and the Constitution Center has scared up a ticket for him. (True story.)
Now for business: I wrote in this morning's Note that Barack Obama may have more pressure on him than Hillary Clinton. What I mean by that is, he's the one who has had big new questions about his candidacy emerge in recent weeks. He's the one who's going to be in the spotlight (and Hillary Clinton will make sure that's the case). He's got to show he can close the deal.
That doesn't make his job harder than Hillary Clinton's. On the contrary, she's fighting on a slippery slope -- her negative ratings are rising, which makes it harder for her to attack with credibility. Will she be aggressive (like she was in Myrtle Beach, S.C.), throwing the proverbial "kitchen sink"? Or will she try to look presidential, and let Obama speak (and squirm) for himself?
A quick comment on the setting -- this is an intimate room. The crowd size actually doesn't explain fully how small the room is -- we're talking seven rows of seats in a theater-in-the-round setting. Mostly guests of the candidates and the Constitution Center. So don't expect whoops and hollers -- this should be more of a discussion than a shout-fest, if the room has anything to do with it.
April 16, 2008 | Permalink | User Comments (3521)
Still wondering if this is going to be streamed live anywhere for us hyper-involved West Coast folk???
Obama 2008 -- Yes, WE CAN!!!
Posted by: Jackt51 -- Vietnam Vet and Proud Liberal | Apr 16, 2008 6:15:50 PM
it is clear that since the wright controversy the republicans with fox has made a temporary retreat regarding bad news for obama. the reason is obvious, they now know he is by far the weaker more vulnerable candidate. he will be crushed in a general election. news we now see only occasionally popping up in the periphery in some odd magazine will be front page news.
it is remarkable how bad and biased the journalism and reporting have been so far. although abc is far better then e.g. msnbc - hillary must have broken all of chris, keith and tims toys when they were young - why not use this opportunity to apologize for the media as a whole, and from now apply a more balanced reporting.
Posted by: Peter | Apr 16, 2008 6:17:24 PM
Yes , I was wondering the same thing ! For us hyper involved expats in europe !!! Come on ABC !! Stream it ....
Posted by: MsCiara | Apr 16, 2008 6:20:34 PM
Clinton bias!!
EFF-U!!!
Posted by: Peter Jennings | Apr 16, 2008 6:21:01 PM
What do people see in that Obama?
Posted by: granny | Apr 16, 2008 6:21:11 PM
Clinton Campaign - kitchen sink campaign
Obama Campaign - toilet and everything that gets flushed in it campaign
Posted by: McCainb4Obama | Apr 16, 2008 6:22:14 PM
I think we should ask the two following questions:
Obama: about his comment in SF
and to BALANCE IT OUT
Hillary: Clinton on Working-Class Southerners, circa 1995: "Screw 'em"
Posted by: moeen | Apr 16, 2008 6:23:25 PM
you Neo-Cons make me sick!!
Posted by: Alan Dershowitz | Apr 16, 2008 6:24:00 PM
Rick,
A question from Portugal. It will be streamed live? There are a lot of people interested back here...
Thanks
Posted by: Nuno Gouveia | Apr 16, 2008 6:24:05 PM
I am looking forward to tonights debate because it will be interesting to see how each candidate responds to the pressure of "expectations". I have seen every debate thus far and find them to be enjoyable and informative. The democratic process is a delite to see this election cycle.
Posted by: Gregory | Apr 16, 2008 6:24:06 PM
I just want to make sure that the news story of Hillary Clinton saying "Screw 'em" to the southern working class gets some attention tonight. More here:
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/04/16/hillary-clinton-on-workin_n_97017.html
Posted by: Tony | Apr 16, 2008 6:26:57 PM
Posted by: anika | Apr 16, 2008 6:29:31 PM
I hope they ask obama, why is he wearing a flag pin now? he wouldn't before now.........
Posted by: mccain/clinton nov | Apr 16, 2008 6:31:50 PM
Hillary is more knowledgable. She will win.
Posted by: THE WINNER | Apr 16, 2008 6:32:04 PM
They cling to their...antipathy for people who are not like them...typical white people...and you want black people to say god bless America .... No No No God Dam* America... Hillary ain’t never been called a nig*r.
This is the man we want to rule the free world?
Posted by: Jason | Apr 16, 2008 6:32:43 PM
I want to know why Obamba Voted for tax Breaks for Big Oil and Gas Companies, Then denied taking money from them.
How can he vote for something, Take money from it, Then say he's against it?
Posted by: David | Apr 16, 2008 6:34:08 PM
Thanks, anika
Posted by: Jackt51 -- Vietnam Vet and Proud Liberal | Apr 16, 2008 6:35:26 PM
If Obama becomes the Dem nominee, I will vote for McCain.....
A lifelong Democrat like me can't stand to watch an Anti-American get elected
Posted by: CowboyJack | Apr 16, 2008 6:36:33 PM
obama will never win in nov. Its time to get him out of race.. vote clinton..
Posted by: women rule | Apr 16, 2008 6:36:49 PM
Obama looks down on people of faith and gun owners. He must be an elitist. Then maybe NOT, he is a friend of Rezco and William Ayers and Rev Wright was his spiritual advisor.
Posted by: Dooley | Apr 16, 2008 6:37:34 PM
I used to say anyone but a
Republican! After hearing all of Clintons lies and her horrible negative caqmpaign, I now say "Anyone but a Clinton" Obama you are right people do pray more and immerse themselves in various things to get away from lifes everyday pressures and troubles.
Posted by: roselyne | Apr 16, 2008 6:37:52 PM
Our local ABC affiliate tells us that ABC refuses to feed live to the West Coast. Why?
Posted by: dana | Apr 16, 2008 6:38:03 PM
Obama's under sniper fire...............
Posted by: Noveed | Apr 16, 2008 6:38:59 PM
I wonder if ABC will call him on it when he's rude and interrupts Hillary. I found that to be very rude on how he shakes his finger, or interrupts before it's his turn..
Not one person has called him on it yet.
That's a shame...
Posted by: David | Apr 16, 2008 6:39:08 PM
JAKE TAPPER: YOU OBAMA SHILL...
your report on ABC World News Tonight was such an endorsement for Obama!! You should be working for NBC
Posted by: CowboyJack | Apr 16, 2008 6:41:18 PM
Hilary, what was your relationship with Stan Lee & Peter Paul during your senatorial campaign.
Posted by: Kingsley | Apr 16, 2008 6:42:24 PM
David:
Because he's Obama!
Posted by: S | Apr 16, 2008 6:44:31 PM
i would like to ask both canidates this question. with oil at 112.00 a barrel, rising food prices ect, ect, it is well known that there is vast amounts of untapped oil in alaska and the gulf of mexico. when is the government going to do something about it? as far as obama is concerned he says he will not take any money from the big oil companies yet he voted to give big tax breaks to the oil companies. in my opinion he talks out of both sides of his mouth. also, when bill clinton was president in 1999 before the big dummy bush took over the country had a balanced budget and gas was 99 cents a gallon. i for one am voting for hillary because i believe she can get this country back on its feet again
Posted by: doug | Apr 16, 2008 6:44:46 PM
i would like to ask both canidates this question. with oil at 112.00 a barrel, rising food prices ect, ect, it is well known that there is vast amounts of untapped oil in alaska and the gulf of mexico. when is the government going to do something about it? as far as obama is concerned he says he will not take any money from the big oil companies yet he voted to give big tax breaks to the oil companies. in my opinion he talks out of both sides of his mouth. also, when bill clinton was president in 1999 before the big dummy bush took over the country had a balanced budget and gas was 99 cents a gallon. i for one am voting for hillary because i believe she can get this country back on its feet again
Posted by: doug | Apr 16, 2008 6:44:52 PM
"I wrote ... Barack Obama may have more pressure on him than Hillary Clinton... he's the one who has had big new questions about his candidacy emerge in recent weeks."
What the f*ck are you spouting you idiot?
Bosnia gunfire?
Helped Northern Ireland?
Children's Healthcare?
NAFTA BS?
"Honesty" polling dropping 20 points?
$109MILLION for SPEECHES?? (according to Hill, speeches mean nothin')
The Hillary BIAS is disgusting.
Posted by: MGBYG | Apr 16, 2008 6:45:34 PM
AH THE CLINTONS MASTER MANIPULATORS AND OBVIOUSLY GREAT LIARS---AND NOW PUTTING THEMSELVES AHEAD OF THE GOOD OF THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY---ITS ALL ABOUT THEM --SURE THEY RELATE TO US-HA-THEM AND THEY 100 MILLION DOLLAR PAYCHECK !!! OBAMA COULD HAVE HAD NEGATIVE ADS RUNNING ABOUT SNIPER BULLETS, CLINTON ADVISERS WHO MET WITH COLUMBIANS ETC BUT HE DIDNT-HE DIDNT STOOP TO THE CLINTONS NEGATIVE ATTACKS. WHAT KIND OF RELIGIOUS PERSON RUNS VICIOUS ATTACK ADS LIKE CLINTONS-SHES A FAKE !!!!!!!!!!!!
Posted by: izzy | Apr 16, 2008 6:46:29 PM
I have watched all the debates and Senator Clinton has won them all. But still the press especially ABC and CNN only report negatively on the Clintons. One must ask are they backing Senator Obama. What about all the lobbyist who are supporting him while he continue to say he is the only one not taking money from them. Is that not a streching of the truth
Posted by: Richad | Apr 16, 2008 6:47:15 PM
To "Dooley"...
"Obama looks down on people of faith and gun owners."
Obama supports the second amendment, and was today endorsed by the American Hunters and Shooters Association (an alternative to the NRA that believes that the NRA does not focus enough on preserving the environment for hunters and sportsmen, and has been too focused on gun manufacturers instead of owners), and is a 'man of faith' himself. Funny how people try to attack the man for "looking down on people of faith" and lash out at his former pastor in the same breath.
William Ayers is a college professor now, and Obama (also a college professor) went to one party that Ayers was also at once.
Rezko was involved with a lot of political fundraising and has been associated with a lot of candidates in Illinois. Mr. Obama has never been tied to any wrongdoing in relation to Rezko - except by people like Sean Hannity and Bill O'Reilly who are desperate to find any "dirt" they can on Obama.
Maybe you should turn off Fox once in a while and try watching some real news. Or better yet, turn off the TV and actually read something.
Posted by: Chris R | Apr 16, 2008 6:48:24 PM
ATTENTION FELLOW AMERICAN.
Here is the truth, has anyone bother to find out why Gov. Ed rendll has left his constitutional duty and continue to campaign for Hilary along every street? Pls my fellow Penns don't allow yourselves to be used, he is fighting for his own personal interest, he knew his political life has come to an end if Hilary did not win since this's last lap as a Governor. Think and vote wise Hilary is good at using people and dumping them, if you have problems tomorrow she will disassociate herself and deny you, trust me.
Posted by: Peter, NY | Apr 16, 2008 6:48:48 PM
let's see how much studdering he does???? He is so funny to listen to, he can only say " I agree with Hillary, otherwise he studders....
Posted by: lady | Apr 16, 2008 6:50:24 PM
What delusional person could possibly believe that CNN and ABC only report negatively on the Clintons? Obama has certainly gotten his share of bad press! Also, to say that Senator Clinton has won all of the debates is an opinion, not a fact. Some would disagree.
Posted by: Phil | Apr 16, 2008 6:51:16 PM
The NRA didn't endorse Obama and Hillary can actually shoot a gun and we all know about Obama's church.
Posted by: Dooley | Apr 16, 2008 6:52:51 PM
I want to know why Obamba Voted for tax Breaks for Big Oil and Gas Companies, Then denied taking money from them.
How can he vote for something, Take money from it, Then say he's against it?
Posted by: David | Apr 16, 2008 6:53:15 PM
WOW well I'm for Obama, I was at the event i San Francisco after the event where all the "bitter" stories have come from. Most people need economics as their primary interest - unless we are scared by fear, used by Bush for sure to gin up the votes in the 04 election as a deliberate tactic to play to the votes in the Rust Belt and beyond. He never delivered any economic substance in fact we are all i dire straights unless you are very wealthy.
None of us attending those events are elite, we all came from other cities, the venues were in a wealthy neighborhood.
I do not have a job, my son is in Iraq, I'm 60 years old, a woman and white.
While I am an attorney I was the oldest of 9 kids and paid my way the whole way.
Anyway, I'm for Obama, California
Posted by: Kathie | Apr 16, 2008 6:53:28 PM
I wonder if ABC will call him on it when he's rude and interrupts Hillary. I found that to be very rude on how he shakes his finger, or interrupts before it's his turn..
Not one person has called him on it yet.
That's a shame...
Posted by: David | Apr 16, 2008 6:53:38 PM
The media prefers Obama because they give me more story lines. The same reason they wanted Bush in office.
Posted by: lady | Apr 16, 2008 6:53:39 PM
NBC (the National Barack Channel) is Obama's biggest campaign strategist....
ABC (Always Barack Channel) is right behind them
CNN is probably the most objective channel on tv (if you exclude Jack "run away from the scene of the crime" Cafferty and Anderson "I will not reveal my sexuality" Cooper
Posted by: CowboyJack | Apr 16, 2008 6:56:24 PM
I have never heard CNN report the Larry Sinclair story. It is an unbelievable story.
Posted by: Dooley | Apr 16, 2008 6:57:19 PM
Its obvious Hilary lack English comprehension, that has been proven when she could not differentiate between denounce and reject, hahahahahahaha!
Posted by: KC, NY | Apr 16, 2008 6:57:25 PM
This election will come down to Ohio, Pennsylvania, and Florida........
No matter who the Dem nominee is, they'll win all the typical big, blue states....
but Obama CANNOT WIN OH, PA, and FL....
Archie Bunker Dems don't want to vote for him, but they would vote for Hillary
Posted by: CowboyJack | Apr 16, 2008 6:58:07 PM
Wow! You clintonistas are a piece of work!!!
Obama 2008 -- Yes, WE CAN!!!
Posted by: Jackt51 -- Vietnam Vet and Proud Liberal | Apr 16, 2008 6:58:16 PM
Substance or style? I vote for susbstance and experience.
Posted by: lady | Apr 16, 2008 6:58:22 PM
To KC: Don't criticize English comprehension if you don't know the difference between "its" and "it's"
Posted by: mike | Apr 16, 2008 7:00:22 PM
Since today marks the first anniversary of the Virgina Tech massacre, I hope George or Charlie asks the candidates where they stand on gun control. With Senator Clinton touting the values of hunting, it would be especially enlightening for the voters of Pennsylvania - as well as the rest of the country - to hear both candidates true feelings on this important matter. With the two candidates pandering to Pennsylvania voters about which of them loves guns the most, let's have a question on this topic.
Posted by: Lesleyann | Apr 16, 2008 7:00:23 PM
Obama's story is kinda like Tales of the Arabian Nights.
Posted by: Dooley | Apr 16, 2008 7:01:38 PM
Wow, Charles Gibson and ABC News sure are Clinton haters. What's that all about? It took 1 Clinton to fix the mess after the 1st Bush, and it's going to take 2 Clintons to fix the mess after the 2nd Bush.
Let's hope Charles and the small Greek-American midget reporter will be more fairer in their debate "moderating..................."
Posted by: Philadelphia Freedom | Apr 16, 2008 7:02:54 PM
Yes, Dooley, it is.
As in NOT BELIEVABLE!!!
Obama 2008 -- Yes, WE CAN!!!
Posted by: Jackt51 -- Vietnam Vet and Proud Liberal | Apr 16, 2008 7:04:14 PM
"Lady", "Kathie", etc. -
What's with all the unfounded claims of ABC being "biased" in favor of Obama? Got any facts to back that up?
I take it you don't read the blogs by ABC reporters too often, particularly "Political Punch", which jumps down Obama's throat at every opportunity (including the ridiculous "I think I might have smelled cigarette smoke on Obama's suit jacket one time last year" post).
Reporters do try to dig up and rehash "me more story lines", but there's no factual evidence of concerted anti-Hillary, pro-Obama "bias" beyond Hillary complaining and bringing up Saturday Night Live skits in the last debate (and she had "the media" eating out of her hand and treating her with kid gloves for many weeks afterwards).
Hillary's benefited from playing the media like a fiddle then, and she's been benefitting from it this week - witness the media's continuing spin and rehashing of the "bitter" statement all week. It's a completely media-manufactured "controversy" that's not really all that newsworthy, but that reporters play up to the point of ridiculous hyperbole and label a "firestorm".
But they're biased towards Obama? I don't think so. They're "biased" towards one thing: getting ratings, and selling newspapers and magazines. Advertising dollars is what it's all about, and that's why what passes for "news" these days gets turned to "infotainment", while real discussion of the actual issues that need to be discussed and would make for a true "debate" get left by the wayside.
Posted by: Chris R | Apr 16, 2008 7:04:26 PM
Hillary has not gotten a break from the media this whole campaign.
Posted by: lady | Apr 16, 2008 7:04:41 PM
I hope issues get blogged besides hate, and everyone realizes how important for our country the next President to be connected to us and really fix the problems which are destroying our country
nite
Posted by: Kathie | Apr 16, 2008 7:06:07 PM
Yes, they are biased for ratings and Obama will give them lots of story lines as he screws up...ha ha ha
Posted by: lady | Apr 16, 2008 7:06:09 PM
Obama can't win in OH, PA, and FL b/c Archie Bunker Democrats don't want to vote for him ....
that means he can't win the general election
Posted by: CowboyJack | Apr 16, 2008 7:07:25 PM
Katie, do you think Obama would for the sake of the country and unity, accept the VP spot so that we can get the white house?
Posted by: lady | Apr 16, 2008 7:07:57 PM
Can anyone tell me if they heard the report from Fox News today? According to the the Huffingting Post in 1995 - Hillary told Bill Clinton to tht he did not owe the working class voters anything and to "scre 'em". If this is true then I know who the Ral Elitist is and that is Hillary Clinton!
Posted by: Brina | Apr 16, 2008 7:08:31 PM
I would like to know where the polls were done that show Obma surging? I Obama territory? Im telling you that man is not what he appears to be, he is very cunning and deceitful and scares the hell out of me!
Posted by: CHARLIESBABI | Apr 16, 2008 7:09:34 PM
Can anyone tell me if they saw the report from Fox News today? According to the the Huffingting Post in 1995 - Hillary told Bill Clinton to that he did not owe the working class voters anything and to "screw 'em". If this is true then I know who the Real Elitist is and that is Hillary Clinton!
Posted by: Brina | Apr 16, 2008 7:10:09 PM
This is fantastic stuff........gripping to see something interesting come out of america
Posted by: Kojo, Dublin Ireland | Apr 16, 2008 7:10:57 PM
90% of candidate platforms never filters through the congress. So, most of the talk of what they will do once then get there is BS.
What is more important is the approach-how they will do it. Obama is America's only hope to reset its negative image in the world and move this country away from destroying its future generation by borrwing form them to wage wars. That is assuming, majority of Americans have not forgotten that that North America is not all there is to the palnet - as this will become increasingly evident and will marginilize America's influence and economic might in the next 30 years.
Posted by: Kanan | Apr 16, 2008 7:10:59 PM
WILL: Can I propose Will’s Law? We can all agree on this. Three liberals and Will. Will’s Law is that no company, such as JPMorgan now, or BearStearns, that is getting substantial subvention from the federal government shall be allowed to pay any of its executives for than the GS-15, that’s $124,000. That would stop the run to Washington.
Posted by: angie yaich | Apr 16, 2008 7:11:06 PM
Tell that to the Phillies from the 1970s for many years in a row that was unachieved fight song > "Yes we can" - NOT.
Hillary Clinton has 8 years of experience in the White House, and this is no time for amateurs like Crockabama.
I believe Crockabama is better suited as a Supreme Court Justice, and I would totally support him for a bench spot at the get go, but he's no MLK (although he tries to sound like him) and he's not up to speed to be President. No way. It's time for President Hillary Clinton.
Look, males have had their way for over 200 years with the office, it's time for a qualified woman like Hillary.
Posted by: Philadelphia Freedom | Apr 16, 2008 7:11:48 PM
Charliebabi......you know same thinh was said about MLK? Shd tell you we never can recognise the greats until they are dead Hope Amrecia does not waste this one...and I mean Obama
Posted by: Kojo, Dublin Ireland | Apr 16, 2008 7:13:47 PM
Will you ask him about Auchi?
Posted by: JoeSky | Apr 16, 2008 7:15:10 PM
With all the posturing and recovering you are both doing regarding various public comments that you have made, can either one of you make the distinction of how you are not going to become a member of the "good ole boys" when you get into office; especially with Sen. Clinton's former familiarity, and with Sen. Obama's lack of inner workings within the Oval Office, I find it very hard to believe that neither one of you will fall victim to the natural progression of political trappings?
Posted by: Jp Ann | Apr 16, 2008 7:15:22 PM
how come Obama disapproved carter's meeting with Hamas when meeting with jewish leaders today. He himself once said that he is willing to meet Iran and syria to resolve mideast dispute. well, he is not getting my vote. please ask him this question during the debate.
Posted by: m. kapta | Apr 16, 2008 7:16:03 PM
Please vote the Clintons for a third term. We are destined to be ruled by the Clintons and Bushes forever. That is our destiny, we do not deserve better.
Hillary, the fighter, the Bosnia sniper warrior, the spouse of the businessman that collected $850,000 from the Colombian government to promote a trade agreement that she rejects and renounces. She is our savior, Saint Hillary. The master of 13 point plans for every problem, the favorite of all Washington lobbyists..
Hillary 08, all the way. Ready to "LEAD" on day one.
Posted by: Jim | Apr 16, 2008 7:17:08 PM
Obama did...Go to Rev Wright's church and hear his racist message. Obama didn't...believe Rev. Wrights message but he attended and heard it for 20 years and words do count but, if the words offended him, why didn't he attend another church? Obama did before he didn't.
Posted by: Dooley | Apr 16, 2008 7:17:09 PM
And will he get the first question this time? Or you will let him go with his usual response "I agree with Hillary".
Posted by: JoeSky | Apr 16, 2008 7:18:02 PM
Hey ".babi": Hillary has the experience and the MLK wannabe has what - "hope?" C'mon, we need action here in the USA - not hope shmope. You don't even have an MLK in Ireland. It's late there, so get to bed.
Posted by: Philadelphia Freedom | Apr 16, 2008 7:18:17 PM
"In January 1995, as the Clintons were licking their wounds from the 1994 congressional elections, a debate emerged at a retreat at Camp David. Should the administration make overtures to working class white southerners who had all but forsaken the Democratic Party? The then-first lady took a less than inclusive approach. 'Screw 'em,' she told her husband. 'You don't owe them a thing, Bill. They're doing nothing for you; you don't have to do anything for them.'"
Posted by: Jim B | Apr 16, 2008 7:18:45 PM
We are here in Pennsylvania and have already filled out our absentee ballot. So at this point, we have already decided as many with absentee ballots already have. What scared us about Barack Hussain Obama were the comments of his former Pastor, Wright, and the fact he used poor judgement staying in such a hate oriented church (even Oprah got out). As a Catholic for close to 50 years, not once have I heard a sermon or any kind of similar political comments from any Pastor. When Catholics even discuss anything resembling politics such as abortion, we are immediately criticized and challenged for our tax exempt status - why hasn't the same happened here? There is a real double standard which is truly unfair to white Americans and the fact is that blacks can and do get away with racism, hate crimes and bigotry against whites all of time, which is an outrage! Secondly, he lacks any real experience and has constantly been running for office instead of acting in office. Finally, he does come off as elitist when he talks about folks in PA clinging to their guns and religion. We happen to support both and find comfort in our Religion and support in the fact that we can hunt if we wish to. Good luck Hilary, you will need all the help you can get when we vote for McCain in the Fall (of course we changed parties just to vote in the primary).
Posted by: Clemantine | Apr 16, 2008 7:19:01 PM
Senator Obama proposes that his Health Care Plan will cover many individuals currently without health insurance by allowing those between the ages of 18-25 to be included on their parents' insurance. He has not been confronted with these facts:
1)If employer sponsored health insurance plans begin to cover 18-25 year old children of employees this will shift an extra monetary burden to the employers as well as the parents.
2)Not all employers offer Health Care benefits to their employees.
3)Not everyone in the 18-25 year old age bracket have parents in their lives.
4)What about 18-25 year olds who are married? Is he proposing that parents should be responsible for health care for their married chidren, the children's spouses and even the children's children?
Posted by: PAK | Apr 16, 2008 7:19:15 PM
To Dooley again:
"The NRA didn't endorse Obama and Hillary can actually shoot a gun and we all know about Obama's church."
When was the last time the NRA endorsed a Democratic presidential candidate? Do you really expect a group that seems to think you need an AK-47 to shoot a pheasant to endorse Hillary Clinton either? The NRA will predictably endorse McCain, if they endorse anyone.
When asked by reporters when the last time was when she actually shot a gun this week, she replied "I don't think that's relevant" and avoided the question. In the previous primary debates this season, one of the questions to the Democratic candidates was to raise your hand if you have EVER had a gun in the house - neither Hillary nor Obama raised their hands. Hillary's no gun owner, and the only "proof" that she's ever fired a gun is her own story saying she once learned to shoot behind a cabin when she was a kid.
And if the only thing you know about Obama's church in Chicago is the same edited soundbites looped continuously on Fox News, then no, you don't know "all about" Obama's church or their congregation, or their works.
But of course, it's a lot easier to put the blinders on and see only what you want to see - to only 'let in' information that supports your own prejudices and backs up your foregone conclusions, than it is to educate yourself with information from both sides of a story or an issue, and make an informed decision based on facts and rational thought. It's a lot easier to let heated emotion take over than it is to allow your own preconceptions to be challenged, or to challenge your own ideas to make sure they stand up when looked at from other angles. It's a lot easier to repeat what a political campaign's strategists and spin doctors want you to repeat than it is to think for yourself.
But taking the "easy" path, and falling prey to "low information voter" syndrome, is what's gotten the country into the ditch it's in now. Do we want to climb out, or do we want to keep digging?
Posted by: Chris R | Apr 16, 2008 7:21:03 PM
Ask him about the lobbyist money too. Obama goes on and on about he doesn't have tie with corporate, he doesn't take lobbyists money. And Obama supporters believe him. But the research said he does take money from lobbyists.
http://www.usatoday.com/news/politics/election2008/2008-04-15-obama_N.htm
Posted by: JoeSky | Apr 16, 2008 7:21:48 PM
Our ins stops covering at 23.
Posted by: lady | Apr 16, 2008 7:22:11 PM
Clemantine: McCain was not born in the United States, he was born in a foreign country (Panama), and under our United States Constitution across from where tonight's debate is being held it was signed, he is INELIGIBLE to be President. There is no wiggle space here. Even if he's elected, he should be precluded from ever taking the oath of office. If he's not, it sounds like another Republican Charmin action with our Constitution...................
Posted by: Philadelphia Freedom | Apr 16, 2008 7:24:21 PM
Maybe, Obama's comments about religious faith and guns and thier relationship with bitterness comes from Rev Wright and his church which he attended for 20 years.
Posted by: Dooley | Apr 16, 2008 7:24:58 PM
f Obama becomes the Dem nominee, I will vote for McCain.....
A lifelong Democrat like me can't stand to watch an Anti-American get elected
u said it jack
Posted by: al | Apr 16, 2008 7:25:34 PM
Panama Canal, a US Territory
Posted by: lady | Apr 16, 2008 7:25:43 PM
If this is to be a fair and square debate we should be asking a lot of internal
And external questions as to running this country, instead of taking it for granted only because someone looks real presidential or talks presidential.
Let them get down to the nitty-gritty things about the real knowledge that it really takes to be president.
Remember that at least 50% of this country fell for it with Bush, and look what we got? An 8th- grade man that knows 30% less than a forth grader.
But he really looked good and spoke a good story.
Let’s not make the same mistake again.
And watch out world!
If a war arises, this guy we have now will remain in office.
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