The Obama v Graham late-nite smackdown

James Danley - I was not say the rounding up during WW II was right, I brought that up because people state that it is impossible to do, but it was done already, we have the capabilities.

As far as deporting ones found here after crossing, we should work on a solution there after sealing the border.

The government says it only take 24 hours to do a background check, at least that is what they have in the bill. So it should not be that difficult to catch them and deport. (This is being sarcastic)

Spock, illegal aliens who are apprehended AS they cross the border can be immediately deported without a hearing. However, those individuals who have been here MUST have a hearing to determine that they are, in fact, here illegally.

Now as for rounding up people like was done in WWII, that was wrong on several levels. Besides, the majority of those rounded up were American citizens. But they weren't deported, instead they were interned.

James Danley I agree with your last staement, both parties are responsible.

and yes we are responsible for allowing them here, but if states are not enforcing what is on the books not, do you think they are going to enforce anything here. The goverment is breaking the law as we speak, because they passed a law to build a 700 mile fence and have it completed by end of summer, they only did a mile.

This will kill/murder the entitlement programs already on the route to suicide.

We do not need to deport, if we enforce laws and go after employers they will leave on their own, but hey we rounded how many people during WWII, i am not saying to do it but it can be done. Since they are not going to jail nor are they citizens they do not need a hearing, for deporting them is technically not punishment.

This whole thing with breaking up family, so if someone that has a family robs a bank, we can not punish them.

Did you know it is given Amnesty to illegals that already broke other laws, such as Child molestation, ID theft and so on, so do you think they are going to deport if they commit a crime later.

They voted down the amendment to not give amnesty to criminals.

ENFORCE CURRENT LAWS, Close the Brder and then talk about what is in the country.

The Immigration problem has been festering for several decades. And it's not just the Feds who are to blame. Although the federal court system expecting illegals to show up for future court dates after releasing them back into society has exasperated the problem. But the local communities and states have just as much -- if not more -- of the blame. Many local communities and several states have laws AGAINST asking if a person is legal or not. When immigrants are pulled over for traffic violations or even arrested for serious crimes, the cops are not allowed to ask if the immigrants are legal. And as if that wasn't bad enough, a number of states have passed laws that require free education and emergency health care, and is some cases even welfare for these illegal aliens. This has been going on for over 20 years.

It is NOT the illegal aliens' fault that the various government agencies failed to enforce existing laws and are giving them free services! Many of these illegal aliens have done nothing wrong -- BESIDES illegally crossing the border in search of jobs in order to support their families. If Mexico had a better economy, then their citizens wouldn't feel forced to come to the United States for work. But that's another issue!

The Immigration Bill is not perfect. But to do nothing, and to continue allowing the abuses is even worse. You might as well accept the fact that there is no way that the federal government will -- or can -- deport 12-20 million illegal aliens from our society. Do you understand what it would take to deport 12-20 million illegal aliens? And I'm not even addressing the cruelty in ripping apart households by deporting parents with children -- born here -- and in some cases are now in their teens. EACH AND EVERY INDIVIDUAL illegal alien would have to have a hearing. That alone would tie up the judicial system that is already stretched to its limits. Murderers, rapists and other offenders would not be held accountable for their crimes because their due process and their right to a speedy trial would force the courts to drop the charges against them.

Now it may be true that the goverment will have only 24 hours to conduct background checks before issuing the new V-visas. But I don't believe there is anything in the bill to prevent the government from voiding an issued V-visa should something turn up later; and certainly if the V-visa holder commits a future crime. But the most important thing is that there are specific benchmarks that must be met with regards to closing down the borders BEFORE the provisions for the temporary worker program and the potential path to eventual citizenship kick in.

Congress' inability to act on national problems is nothing new. Just look at the looming disaster with the entitlement programs: Social Security and Medicare. The members of Congress -- both parties -- are more interested in their own personal re-elections and power then solving problems that left unresolved have the ability to bankrupt the country. Members of Congress were elected to serve the best interest of their constituents and the country as a whole, NOT for their own personal interests!

chuck the 5 year was for the merit system, Obama wants illegals to bring in their extended families. and is against the merit system so in 5 years he wanted to get rid of the merit system.

and yes I would of loved being a Fly on the wall to hear two senators argue over who can shaft us better.

The bill gives amnesty to all illegals, when they come out of the shadows and apply, the goverment only has 24 hours to check their background and after that they get amnesty. (When has our goverment ever able to do something in 24 hours) They also then will be eligible for Medicare, Social Sercurity and so on. They only have to pay back taxes and 5000$ if they want citizenship.

The solution is McCain want to know it is Close the Border period with and out going door. Then go after any employer that hires an illegal alien and fine them triple the cost that it costs the taxpayers for each illegal in the country.

Did you know that the bill actually has a portion in there that states child molesters get amnesty if there question about the age, This is sick. Gang members if they denounce the gang get amnesty.

Like the majority ENFORCE the Current Laws and Build the Fence.

I think everyone concerned needs a "time-out" here, and needs to step back from the madding crowd. It's a pity that Sen. Graham took the amendment a little too personally and resorted to high dudgeon when denouncing it, and that Sen. Obama immediately responded in equal measure in its defense. Although I fail to see how the bill is irrevocably damaged if there is a provision for it to be reevaluated in five years, I can fully understand the frustration that the bill's creators must feel for unequivocally supporting it in its unaltered form. I would've liked to be an eavesdropper on the conversation which continued in the hall, though!

I understand where Graham's coming from, in that McCain has taken a lot of heat for backing the proposal. So I guess his logic is that Democrats need to similarly take their lumps. I guess that's what passes for bipartisonship nowadays.

Now I like the measure and admire McCain for endorsing it, in spite of the political hit. Graham's criticism seems a little heavy handed though - like he's bullying Obama.

Enforce the laws we have!!!!!!!!!!

Wake up America!!!! We are in BIG trouble!!!!

I disagree. The point is that we need to do something. This bill would actually close the border and have accountability to force employers to hire only LEGAL employees. Now, Obama messed up the deal. I guess we will just have to keep the status quo - because it is working so well. Huh ??These 12 million people have to be checked in a database and accounted for - now that will never happen. What a breach of security. Senator McCain is so right when he says that if you lived on the border - you would understand. To do nothing is the de facto amnesty. NOW there is no incentive to stop hiring illegal aliens, nor for people to come out from the shadows. Why pay taxes now - it doesn't pay if this bill doesn't pass. These people are not going to just leave. If we have a database we can deport the troublemakers and collect fees and force legality. I guess its not important to have accountability of for Congress to address this issue. The bill actually has so much to like, if you are anti-immigration - if you only actually read it. Are we going to round up hard working people who have children born here and deport them? It won't work logistically and it will make America look like the Iron Curtain country now. Something must be done NOW and the status quo is destroying us. To those of you against this bill, fret not because with all these amendments it will never pass anyway. The only way the bill would have survived is if it was kept as is. I guess we will continue to lose all that tax revenue and employers will keep on doing the same. What a shame !

Before our elected officials vote on any immigration bill, one must consider the fact that the majority of them will never be Americans in heart and spirit. The majority Americans will be a minority soon after they are given the right to vote. We will all pay a price not just the poor minorities that exist today.Who cares about immigration? What can be done about the terrorism within our contry right at this moment.

Build the fence. Close the border. Stop new illegal crossings, and then lets talk.

Until then ... I just don't trust either side to do anything.

I do not agree that this immigration bill (S 1348) should pass in its present form. We should close the border and first enforce the laws already on the books. If you entered this country illegally then you certainly shouldn't be provided amnesty in any way. That sends the message that our laws don't apply to immigrants. This definitely is wrong message.

I agree Spock.
Since when did 84% of the population's opinion "not count"?
Americans do not want Amnesty.
This isn't a minority representation for these are not even citizens!
Those who support the North American Union, business lobbyists and a few wealthy leftists are behind Amnesty, the grassroots support AGAINST Amnesty is phenomenal, millions and millions of people making a stand.
And the oligarchy, is ignoring them!

There is a rush because pretty soon everyone will be in campaign mode for 2008 and it will be even more difficult to really get anything accomplished

This whole immigration bill is only doing one thing separating Washington from the Rest of the Country. Both side in Congress are working against the American People, this argument is over who can shaft the American Citizen worst. I can not remember anytime in history that both parties of American Citizens have disagreed with both parties in Congress.

Hey they brought us together against one enemy, Congress !!

Why is there such a Rush on this, why not enforce the laws already on the books.