Political Punch

Sorry, but what do Mormons exactly believe? If the Mormon Bible were clear and did make changes based on divine intervention all the time, maybe there would not be so much skepticism sorrounding the cultist religion. Any Mormon should truly study the religions original inception. I think if more Mormons would study thier own history they would understand that the premise of the religion is a hoax. Joseph Smith was a man who was seeking a quick get rich scheme and he just so happened to come across what is now the basis of what will either send you to heaven or hell. I have been trying to answer why Mormons would believe in something that is faulty. There have been to many changes to the Mormon Bible and the thing is these changes came after intense social and political pressure. I do not think I could believe in a divine message that cracks under the pressure of man. Your God is to small if his book has to be revised to fit social intolerance. Mormons should also do intense study on the Mountain Meadows Massacre. Studying the event will seem to unravel the mystery that sorrounds the religion. Mitt Romney may be a very intelligent man, but I do not want a leader who places his faith in something that has no real spiritual relevance. Furthermore, Mormons are not Christians because in the true Christian Bible there is to be no revision to Gods word. They can not add on divine intervention by a con artist...

Saying that Mormons are not Christians is completely false. In Mormonism, Christ is at the center of everything. What a tragedy it would be if religious bigotry prevents Romney from getting elected. What does that say about this country? Mormons believe in seeking after truth wherever it may be found. This is precisely why Romney is quailified, BECAUSE he is a Mormon. He can unite this country. He knows the proper place of religion and can therefore deal with various viewpoints and combat extremism.

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Saints is the offical name of the Mormon church. They believe Christ is the head of their church. And you born agains say they don't believe in christ. Do your research people!

"...as he might be fooled into believing most anything."

Bwa ha ha ha ha ha. That statement could be applied to all faiths! All religions have some idiotic dogma that defies logic. Using his reasoning we SHOULD be voting for an Atheist. There is no possibility of an atheist being swayed by a Mormon prophet, the Pope, an Iman, or his/her family preacher.

An Atheist would be neutral.

I think it kind of weird that Christians who believe the trinity doctrine believe that Christ, in the Garden, prayed to himself, asking that, if it be His will (Christs, I assume) that this cup will pass over him.
Luke 22:42 Saying, Father, if thou be willing, remove this cup from me: nevertheless not my will, but thine, be done.

Will a trinitarian please explain this to me?

The Church of Jesus Christ (LDS) is often accused by Evangelical pastors of not believing in Christ and, therefore, not being a Christian religion. This helps to clarify such misconceptions by examining early Christianity's comprehension of baptism, the Godhead, the deity of Jesus Christ and His Atonement.

The Church of Jesus Christ (LDS) adheres more closely to First Century Christianity and the New Testament than any other denomination. For example, Harper’s Bible Dictionary entry on the Trinity says “the formal doctrine of the Trinity as it was defined by the great church councils of the fourth and fifth centuries is not to be found in the New Testament.”

Perhaps the reason the pastors and Mike Huckabbee denigrate the Church of Jesus Christ (LDS) is to protect their flock (and their livelihood).

Huckabee never finished the seminary, so I can KINDA believe him when he said he didn't know about Romney's religion. Of course, comparative religion is a sort of low level class, but give him the credit for not being studious and drop it. He DOES believe in creationism, so at least he was awake PART of the time. I wonder how he does on other religions stuff. I know he got his Baptist girl friend Diane O'Connell a government job even though she had no experience. Cost Arkansas 1.6 million, so I guess he fails at not lying. Let's see, he stole $60,000 out of the taxpayer fund so I guess he missed that class about not stealing. He tried to pay himself as a consultant in his own Senatorial election, so he missed that class on not cheating too. He opened a wedding registry at Target and Dillard's while he was governor so his grateful subjects could buy him presents when he and his wife renewed their vows. Hm - guess he missed that class about not coveting his neighbor's possessions too. Wait - maybe there's a simpler explanation. Maybe the Huckster thinks YOU'RE stupid. After all, he DOES support the FairTax, which doesn't tax corporations AT ALL, and millionaires and up at the same rate as someone who is near poverty level - i.e. less than 5%. Here's the thing - religious people really ARE religious. Who among them wants any truck with THIS devil?

Deseretion and other Church of Jesus Christ of Later Day Saints-

The discussion in the media has had a positive effect. I have gained more knowledge and respect for your religion then I had previously.

To folks like DOUG - I love Doug's comment that "Mormonism is a cult if you define a cult as..." Well, duh. Here's another - Doug is a "picnic table" if you define picnic table as something resembling Doug. Doug if YOU wrote the dictionary I suppose Mormons could be termed anything you please, but websters defines a cult as:

1: formal religious veneration : worship
2: a system of religious beliefs and ritual; also : its body of adherents
3: a religion regarded as unorthodox or spurious; also : its body of adherents

So by a dictionary definition ANY faith is a cult. Again ANY FAITH IS A CULT. Now, if you want to claim the third definition fits Mormons,well that's rediculous. Orthodoxy is a purely subjective matter. Catholics consider Protestants un-orthodox. So to a Catholic you belong to a cult. But we all know that the word "cult" is reserved almost exclusively for groups that leave society and drink purple kool-aid to committ suicide. To call the LDS chuch a cult is an insult and people like YOU absolutely intend it to be an insult since the only way you can accurately use the term is if YOU write the definition. In the meantime, please stop being rude and insulting my faith and the 13 million others who practice it.

I want to point out (again) that all the supposed bad press about Mormons is only going to help us in our efforts to tell the world about the Restoration of the Church of Jesus Christ.

If one comes from an atheistic tradition, all of our religious discussions sound like foolishness. This is not because they are; rather, it is because 'faith' is ultimately not susceptible to being proved with tangible evidence.

If, however, one comes from a biblical tradition, there is not one doctrine or practice to be found among present or past Mormon doctrines which cannot be better defended by an appeal to pre-Roman Christians than can the doctrines of all Protestant groups.

Folks gripe about polygamy, and yet, the Semitic peoples were practicioners of polygamy (as, indeed, the Arabs still are). Is is offensive to Western European senses? YES! Does that imply an eternal truth? NO!

Also, all the complaints that Joseph Smith saw visions or used physical helps (seer stones, golden plates, papyri, etc.) to communicate with the Divine forget that the Bible is full of visions (think angels with swords who care whether or not you wear shoes)and physical objects of divine provenance (the Ark, anyone?).

The comments about Mormons being educated is not a new one. If you search the internet, you'll find anti-Mormon headings such as "Do Smart Mormons Make the Mormon Church True?". In other words, the (less educated) Trinity-Christians realize that they lose the majority of their faithful to the educational system while Mormons don't. This assymetry demands explanation. Their only one being, apparently, that Mormons do things WE don't do. They are therefore misguided and wrong. If you pull back from what (only) Americans do, you find that there are no solid reasons to vilify Mormons.

Again, there are NO valid (pre-Roman church) arguments against the doctrines of Mormonism. If you think it is ridiculous that Joseph Smith could have been inspired to write the Book of Abraham through contact with an Egyptian Book of Breathings, know that others think it is more ridiculous that an unwed Jewess was impregnated without sex and birthed a baby who, somehow, was three beings in one, and this child, when grown, saved all men (except the 90% who never heard of him before their death) after talking to himself at his own baptism.

Protestants acknowledge that their Patriarchs practiced polygamy, why can't they be held accountable for that? It is nowhere disavowed in the New Testament.

Protestants believe that the God of all the earth allowed millenia to pass wherein the only receivers of his word were the Israelites. Moreover, they believe that these Israelites were commanded to worship him through the brutal slaughter and mutilation of animals. Where is the outrage?

In one case, they believe that God commanded their polygamous (pre-Mosaic law) patriarch to slaughter his own son! (Those creepy Prostestants, they worship a God who sanctions sex with maids, animal abuse, and possible human sacrifce!!!!)

The truth is, Mormons also believe many of these things. We're not trying to destroy the faith of others, so we don't point out how ridiculous their beliefs also sound.

However, as I've said over and over, once the Trinity-Christians attempt to slander us in the media, the media will soon realize they're throwing stones in the most fragile of glass houses.

I hope that we can learn to help each other. As a Mormon, I find that my natural allies in defending my rights and my neighborhood are almost always faithful Protestants. I encourage my friends, who are Protestants, to attend church (their church, though they're always invited to mine). I support legislation and policies that protect Christians (defined as folks who believe in Jesus Christ as their Saviour).

Why they can't back off and focus on their own faith and the other 99.9% of the world who are not Mormon, I'll never know.

Good luck!

Jann Shipps said that "When a cult grows up, it becomes a culture." So,
Let's focus on the candidates. Come on, like all of us would not love to have Romney's life. He has lived the American Dream. All he sets out to do, works out splendidly. He became the republican governor of a liberal state. He made hundreds of millions starting his own company and then poured back millions into various charities and organizations. He has two graduate degrees from Harvard. The man is great looking and is like a Hollywood cast president. He has an amazing, supportive family. He is not corrupted by this and does'nt have any skeletons in his closet. I would be proud to show him off to the international community. He is realistic and makes positive things happen. He is ambitious and accomplished what he sets out to do. He has been endorsed by big donors, evangelical leaders, and the National Review. He has the best chance of any candidate.

I have seen Mormons elected to office where I live and noone had anything negative to say about it. Many Mormons are well off and involved in the community. I lived in western Phoenix. It is the wealthier part of the city. Many of the suburbs were at least a quarter Mormon and Mesa, the largest suburb, has a majority Mormon population. We all go to the Christmas events put on at the Mormon temple there. Yes non-mormons. I would never say the things that are being said to any of my Mormon neighbors and I would not expect them to say anything negative to me about my religion. This is not true Christianity.

The area that I live in is at least half Mormon. This is in your face religious bigotry. Why are certain born again Christians seeing Romney's faith as an opportunity to attack the tenets of Mormonism and to swear the religion? This is not an educated, Christian thing to do!! Period. There is no excuse for it. If I went out and started saying this stuff about Mormons or any other religious group in my community, it would be seen as religious bigoted hate. This is ridiculous and shameful.

Unfortunately for Gov. Romney not one major protestant denomination or Catholicism considers Mormonism a form of Christianity and requires that a Mormon be baptized to be considered as a Christian.

This only hurts him because he is going for the votes of the very people least likely to vote for him for that very reason, if he were a Democrat it just wouldn't matter that much.

What we are seeing with the Huckabee surge is a revolt of Christian Conservatives within the ranks of the GOP, a revolt that has been totally missed by network news.

Evangelical Interpretations Agree with Catholic Trinity Not Bible necessarily:

Blogger “Core Theology” (CT) posts:
Christians and Mormons worship two DIFFERENT Gods.

Yes. Mormons reject the Catholic creeds of the 3rd and 4th centuries that altered Christian theology and introduced these false doctrines that departed from Biblical Christianity:

1. Rejection of the anthropomorphic God of the early Christians.

2. Creation of the term “uncreated”, “coequal” etc.
Rejection of subordination between God the Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost.

3. Creation of “creation out of nothing” or creation ex nihilo.
Creation of “ontological oneness” and the creation of “persons” in the Godhead.

4. The introduction of receiving a crown in the throne of God through “faith alone” is a doctrine born out of the Protestant reformation and was not taught as an exclusive doctrine by the New Testament apostles.

CT posts that the Bible says that persons in the resurrection are not “married” which is false. The context of the scriptures is that “marriages” will not be performed in “Heaven” which LDS agree with. It’s an ordinance that must be received here on earth. The Bible says “neither is the man without the woman nor the woman without the man IN THE LORD”.

Evangelical Christians are cheating about the “eternal nature” of Jesus Christ. Mormons acknowledge that Jesus took upon himself “additional” nature during his life here on earth that is “permanent”. Therefore, that his nature was “eternally unchanged” is biblically false and is a "creatiion" of certain definition.

Mormons believe that the spiritual essence of Jesus Christ is co-eternal.

Evangelical Christians are cheating with Isaiah scriptures such as Isaiah 44: Such verses are in regard to the worship of false idols – therefore there is only One God among all of the false gods of idolatry. That there is a plurality of gods is clear from “Let’s US make man in OUR own image.” We know from the Bible that Jesus’ “physical image” is eternally permanent. Therefore, the Father, Son and Holy Ghost MUST be separate beings otherwise, the Father and the Holy Ghost would have also been resurrected with a physical body.

Now you watch how Evangelical Christians respond to this post. They will try to justify their beliefs with the Bible but they will actually be quoting the Bible from the “Orthodox Trinity” context. They will try to say that the "US" and the "OUR" refers to the "persons of the Trinity" - an appeal to the Catholic Trinity and NOT the Bible.

Here’s something else that Evangelicals will be required to reconcile in this year: (It's going to get out into the MSM this year - just remember Evagelicals that you brought this on yourselves)

* Early Christians did not believe that God is three co-equal persons in one substance.

* Early Christians believed that the Son is subordinate to the Father and the Holy Ghost is subordinate to the Son.

* Early Christians taught and believed that men can become gods. (They taught that Jesus became a man so that we could learn from a man how to become a god.)

In 250 million years when we’re looking back at Jesus Christ’s life, some will ask “How did Jesus become the Savior of the world?

They will answer: "He was once a man and became the Savior through the shedding of his own blood."

It is silly for Romney to assert that separation of Church and state has gone too far and then to say he won`t tell us what his religious faith is so we can see where the Mormons might want to bring church and state closer together. For example, maybe spending two years proselytising your faith should count as much as actually serving in the military like McCain did.

I agree with Frank. We should let believe as they choose and not hold that against them, unless it obviously influences their behavior or judgment for the worst.

For those of you that believe otherwise, it would seem that you need a friendly reminder of what it means to follow Christ, so I've posted some of his reminding words.

Oh ya, and for those that think Romney's religion might influence his presidency, I've posted one the mormon's "Articles of Faith" below...

Matthew 7:12
"So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you, for this sums up the Law and the Prophets."

Luke 6:27-36
Love Your Enemies
27 "But I say to you who listen: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, 28 bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you. 29 If anyone hits you on the cheek, offer the other also. And if anyone takes away your coat, don't hold back your shirt either. 30 Give to everyone who asks from you, and from one who takes away your things, don't ask for them back. 31 Just as you want others to do for you, do the same for them. 32 If you love those who love you, what credit is that to you? Even sinners love those who love them. 33 If you do [what is] good to those who are good to you, what credit is that to you? Even sinners do that. 34 And if you lend to those from whom you expect to receive, what credit is that to you? Even sinners lend to sinners to be repaid in full. 35 But love your enemies, do [what is] good, and lend, expecting nothing in return. Then your reward will be great, and you will be sons of the Most High. For He is gracious to the ungrateful and evil. 36 Be merciful, just as your Father also is merciful."

12th Article of Faith written by Joseph Smith
We believe in being subject to kings, presidents, rulers, and magistrates, in obeying, honoring, and sustaining the law.

Mormonism is a cult, if you define cult as "Any religious group that deviates from orthodox teachings of historic Christianity, while claiming to be "true Christians" by way of some special revelation or privilege". There are lots of cults out there, Mormonism being one.

Christians and Mormons worship two DIFFERENT Gods.

Here is more of what Mormons believe:
1Mormon – God was once a man like us.
1Christian – God was, is, and always will be God.

2Mormon – Many Gods, an unknown number of them
2Christian – One God. Isaiah 44 “I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God…Is there a God beside me? Yea, there is no God; I know not any.”

3Mormon – Salvation by grace AND works 2 Nephi 25:23
3Christian – Salvation by faith alone. Many verses, one example Ephesians 2:8-9

4Mormon – Men become Gods, have a marriage and children in Heaven
4Christian – “Men become Gods” is blasphemy. Jesus said we will be neither married nor given in marriage in Heaven. Matthew 22:29-30

Mormons and Christians worship a different Jesus as well:

The Jesus of the Bible: Co-Eternal with God, without beginning or end.

The Jesus of Mormonism: Created by a God, who was himself also created. At one time this Jesus was not, then, having been created by God, became. This Jesus is thus less than God.

Different Jesus, different God. One Christian, one not.

Since the beginning, mankind has rejected living prophets while vowing allegiance to dead prophets of previous generations. If God sent a prophet among us today, do you think we'd be any different? Certaibly not! So before any of us discount the man Mormons revere as a prohpet of God, we'd better make sure we understand his teachings and mission. Remember -- every prophet God has sent was viewed with suspicion and contempt by his generation. Study your Bible, people, and read Amos 3:7!

Every religion has skeletons. We are voting for the man not his religion.
But anyway you put it Fred Thompson is the right man for job of President, so vote for him!