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Clinton Camp: 'All The Rules Will Be Going Out The Window'

February 19, 2008 10:05 AM

Our friend Roger Simon has a juicy little column in this morning's Politico where he reports on the Clinton campaign's push not just for superdelegates but regular, pledged delegates.

Whether or not they know it, those delegates purportedly elected to represent the will of the voters of their home states and districts can actually vote any way they want. And according to Simon, "Hillary Clinton’s presidential campaign intends to go after delegates whom Barack Obama has already won in the caucuses and primaries if she needs them to win the nomination.

“I swear it is not happening now, but as we get closer to the convention, if it is a stalemate, everybody will be going after everybody’s delegates,” a senior Clinton official told Simon yesterday. “All the rules will be going out the window.”

The Obama campaign responded harshly this morning.

“As it becomes increasingly clear that Senator Clinton may not be able to secure the nomination by winning the support of actual voters, the Clinton campaign has once again floated a strategy that would essentially say that the preference of Democratic voters is a mere obstacle to their win-at-all-costs strategy," said Obama campaign manager David Plouffe. "First, they said they’ll try to seat the non-existent delegates in Florida and Michigan, something that neutral party leaders have roundly criticized. Then, they suggested that superdelegates should consider subverting the will of the voters and the pledged delegates, which has also been strongly objected to.

“Their new strategy will be to convince delegates that were pledged by actual Democratic voters to switch sides. In their own words, ‘all the rules will be going out the window.’ Voters are already rejecting the Clinton campaign’s say-or-do-anything-to-win tactics, and this is the latest example that it’s time to turn the page on this type of politics that could severely harm our party’s chances to win the general election."

This thing reminds me more and more of the Florida recount. And just as with that contest, the point is not to "count every vote" -- but to win.

- jpt

February 19, 2008 | Permalink | User Comments (133)

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I cannot believe HRC supporters are not OUTRAGED by these tactics that would reverse the will of the voters.

Clinton supporters, please take a look at the CLASS and HONESTY with which your candidate has conducted herself and her campaign. Please investigate your questions yourself and determine your own choice for President. Please make an educated decision! Don't fall for the scandals and twisted lies!

Vote for OBAMA-the People's candidate!

Yours Truly, A White, Educated Pennsylvania Female.

Posted by: Saddened by HRC | Mar 11, 2008 11:59:34 PM

(Jeez, some weird comments. This is the primary race for the nomination not the Book of Revelations.)

Two good candidates. He's managed a superior campaign.

Posted by: rzzzzz | Feb 20, 2008 11:00:35 AM

We have republicans and independents voting for OUR democratic nominee. We have voters in Michigan and Florida who will not get their votes counted. We have this ridiculous super delegate fiasco that will make no one happy. Then we have the media trying to shove Obama down our throats. I will vote for Hillary in the general election as a write-in if she doesn’t win the primary. I urge everyone who refuses to vote for Obama to do the same. Lets send a message to the media that they don’t get to pick our president. Lets send a message to the people who are sexist (men AND women) that we won't stand for their prejudice. Lets send a message to Obama that you can’t buy, charm or fake your way into the presidency. Lets send a message to the DEMOCRATIC PARTY that they had better clean up their act or they are going to lose their base. The hard working middle class Americans living in the reality of the day to day grind. You will find that you need us way more than we need you.

Posted by: Firefighter | Feb 20, 2008 1:18:02 AM

mkevinf says, "Who are you people who would vote for McCain over Hillary in the general? [...] You are either faux Democrats or Republican trolls stirring up the pot of disunity."

There is a third possiblity, mkevinf. We are independants, and neither the Democratic or Republican party completely represents our views. Like sailors trying to sail against the wind, we must tack - continually adjusting course, and choosing the candidate that we trust most to take us closer to our goals.

If Hillary wins the nomination fair and square, I will vote for her in the fall. But if she steals it from the voters via Michigan/Florida, superdelegates, converting pledged delegats, etc., I can not trust her to represent me as president - I can not bring myself to vote for her. And McCain is simply not that bad. There's a reason he gives the conservatives fits. He's opposed to drilling for oil in ANWAR, he voted against the Bush tax cuts, he wants to close Guantanamo, he worked with Kennedy (gasp!) to offer illegal imigrants "amnesty". He worked with Feingold to restrict campaign finance abuses.

mkevinf continues, "I can respect someone who might go to the Green Party, which is a progressive, liberal party. But to go to John McCain? It scares me that people like that have a vote equal to mine."

Be afraid, mkevinf, be very afraid.

Posted by: John | Feb 19, 2008 7:00:17 PM

I think the only thing we all have seen Hillary & Obama run are their caimpaigns. Hers is a mess and his is briliant. So much for her experience. If it is not scripted, she can't handle it. The mean nasty Hillary is starting to emerge. She can win fair and square so she is grasping at straws to win. She is dispicable and I think she is going to lose not because she is nasty but because he is better!

Posted by: julescator | Feb 19, 2008 6:28:55 PM

mkevinf,
Both McInsane and the Hildebeest are rotten to the core, meglomaniacs that would kill their own mother to get more power. I could care less what their politics are; they have been bought by special interests even deeper than the Shrub.

Both not only deserve to lose, but be banished from the American political scene forever. Both will make Richard Nixon look like a sweet guy. Let's get rid of both of these idiots.

Posted by: Guilden_NL | Feb 19, 2008 5:51:10 PM

Who are you people who would vote for McCain over Hillary in the general? Do you honestly believe there is no difference between the two? You are either faux Democrats or Republican trolls stirring up the pot of disunity. Life long Democrats do not take their ball and go home, let alone score points for the other team. This vitriol from both sides must stop! Again, if you think there's no difference between John McCain and Hillary Clinton, please read their records. Like Obama, Hillary has worked with Republicans, something which Obama states is important. But to say that Clinton is no better than Bush or McCain because of some votes you (and I) disagree with is ignorant.
I can respect someone who might go to the Green Party, which is a progressive, liberal party. But to go to John McCain? It scares me that people like that have a vote equal to mine.

Posted by: mkevinf | Feb 19, 2008 5:16:24 PM

Christopher London, AMEN! from a Republican that will vote for Obama but not someone who fancies themselves to be a Stalin or Hitler.

Ken,
Chinese money in US politics? Hmmm, the last time that was a problem with with a fat hypocrite named Al Gore the Bore.

Posted by: Guilden_NL | Feb 19, 2008 5:02:38 PM

As a Floridian, I'm insulted by Clinton's comments that our votes should count because we didn't know they weren't going to count when we voted. That's total nonsense. The fact our votes weren't going to count has been in the headlines here for many months. But if she is right and we Floridians are that out to lunch, it should be an argument for our votes to NOT count.

Posted by: Tim | Feb 19, 2008 4:59:59 PM

The Chinese cannot just inject that kind of money into any campaign. Check the facts on that re campign financing. Good relations with the Chinese is important worldwide and especially since the Bush admin sold so much of the US to them to finance the war. Hillary Clinton will be a fantastic President and the is not just rhetoric.

Posted by: Ken | Feb 19, 2008 3:50:24 PM

Obama has evolved into a really weird cult following being referred to as a messiah and on the other end of the spectrum the light skinned lamb to watchout for from Notradamus. I mean let's get a grip and stop the rhetoric and stand for issues. Everyone has heard the hope message over and over. Hillary Clinton is a solid candidate and we are playing right into the Republicans hands. Let's turn this country around with a good solid, hard-working leader and that will be Hillary Clinton

Posted by: Jamie | Feb 19, 2008 3:47:00 PM

Lest their be no doubt about what the Clintons are: Corrupt, deceitful, manipulative, immoral fascist pigs. This is outrageous that the Clintons will not under any circumstances accept defeat. If the Clintons try to subvert the will of the voters and steal the nomination, Americans will have cause for revolution. Corrupt leaders who steal elections and attempt to thwart the will of the American people will be at risk of being toppled by any means necessary. If the Clintons go down that path, Democracy will not be safe and neither will those who have destroyed Democracy.

Posted by: Christopher London | Feb 19, 2008 3:37:36 PM

If superdelegates decide this contest, I'll vote Republican. I'm sick of people who keep saying Obama isn't experienced enough, too young, blah, blah, blah... I have news for you, it's young people in general that have changed the world. Not old-timers who are out-of-touch with the times.

Posted by: Robert | Feb 19, 2008 3:33:00 PM

It is so funny to read the comments posted by the ignorant Clinton supporters as they try to make a big deal out of Obama using a line in a twenty minute speach from an old friend who share information and lines back and forth for years prior. Even funnier is the knowledge that she also steals lines and plans from everybody and does not even have the class or grace to aknowledge them when caught.

Posted by: Matt | Feb 19, 2008 3:20:00 PM

I think Obama will be a let down, since evryone is referring to him as if he is the second coming of christ,he will not live up to all the hype.

Posted by: Alberto Guzman | Feb 19, 2008 3:11:26 PM

Shame Shame Sahme Hillary Clinton, you and your supporters act more like neocons each day that passes. I would never vote for you!

Posted by: Gerald | Feb 19, 2008 3:10:13 PM

Why do alot of Clinton supporters think that Obama is best suited as HRC VP and run for pres in 2016? Come on! look what happen to Gore. People will be so sick of HRC with her failed promises (due to inability to get legislation passed which no doubt she'll blame solely on the Republicans) after 4 years that the presidency will be handed back to the republicans by 2012.

With the following he is getting, it would be better for him to run as an independent, but as a man of principle i am sure he'll stick with the dem if he is not nominated this time.

Posted by: buj | Feb 19, 2008 2:51:14 PM

Those of you who think that Clinton is horrible for supposedly going after delegates are ridiculous. They are both going to go after each other's delegates. You're an idiot if you think they both won't try it. I stand by the fact that you hateful people voting for Obama is a good sign that it would be a huge mistake to vote for him. I'll never vote for him. I'll either vote McCain or sit this one out before I vote Barack Obama. Not unless I see some positive signs from his supporters. Those of you posting the ugly comments are uglier than Clinton ever tried to be. I just hope some more people wake up to this fact and the fact that he does not have his own ideas. He also borrows his supposed inspiration from other people as well as uses other people's words to defend the whole purpose of his candidacy. He is a walking contradiction and hypocrite. At least Hillary doesn't make any promises that she has to take back because OOPS it's more convenient or politically correct or financially better for her to make that promise at the time. You just don't see that from Hillary.

Posted by: Ellie | Feb 19, 2008 2:48:14 PM

Even tho the Clinton campaign has retracted this, i wonder if Obama would use this to his advantage.

I think he would not stoop to her level by pointing out her shortcomings to gain political point as she does.

Posted by: buj | Feb 19, 2008 2:35:10 PM

Does it bother anyone as to how the media portrays Obama versus Hillary?

He is shown as a super-clean, super-hero. A man who can do no wrong.

She is shown as a villain. A woman who is obsessed with power and will do anything to win.

Look at their respective pictures in news articles. She has her mouth open and her eyes bulging out. He is always calm and presidential.

Come on guys wake-up. Nobody is saying that Hillary is an angel. But neither is she the monster that the media is portraying her as. She is a tough and smart woman. Her husband was the president for 8 years and a pretty good president (forget his personal life). She is ready on day one and that is what this country needs to put things back on track.

My humble opinion!!
--------------------
Hillary's pictures of her with gaping mouth and bulging eyes ARE Hillary. Is the news to depict her as a lady, when she photographs like a vampire?

Mr. Obama is a calm, self-assured man with integrity, honesty, wisdom, good character, good judgement, outstanding leadership and managerial skills, and, yes, far more legislative knowledge and accomplishments than Hillary. Hillary is devoid of these attributes.

So who do want for President: a person who has NO integrity, who is dishonest, who cannot run a decent campaign, but one of chaos and inner turmoil, a person who thinks America OWEs her the Presidency, who wants to win no matter if it destroys our democracy and our country? A person who is totally concerned about her ownself with no regard for us, "We the People"? Who has no regard of our democracy and our nation? A person who believes this election is totally ALL ABOUT HILLARY? A person who shuns smaller states and caucus states as unimportant and inconsequential?

OR

A person of good character, integrity, honesty, good judement, superior legislative knowledge, hard work, and accomplishment, a man who gets results by being a uniter, a person who wants us, "WE THE PEOPLE" to be part of a new and revitalized America, a person who believes in "A GOVERNMENT FOR THE PEOPLE AND BY THE PEOPLE"? A person who WILL work WITH AND FOR THE PEOPLE? A person who believes EVERY STATE IS INDEED IMPORTANT?

Thank you, I'll vote for Mr. Obama, a man of values and integrity!

Posted by: NinaK | Feb 19, 2008 2:18:05 PM

I am a rational senior citizen feminist who will use my credit card to travel to the Convention to protest the Democratic party machine if it ignores the will of the people and give the candidacy to the Clintons. This how low the Clintons have brought the party down to, and with the party our republic. Hillary is doing everything unethical and unfair in order to win. Hers is not the face of a feminist nor the face of a nation that wishes to lead the world away from war toward peace and plenty. The Clintons' two-faced run for co-presidency is sickening so many of us, and with us, the party and the country.

Posted by: shirlin | Feb 19, 2008 2:13:50 PM

Has it occurred to anyone else that the Clintons would have more clout and more cash (via their continued preeminence in the party) under a McCain presidency than they would with Obama in the White House? Obviously they would prefer to capture (fairly or otherwise) the nomination and win in the general election. But the fact is that an Obama presidency would eclipse both Clintons and make it a whole lot harder to generate those millions of dollars per month in speaking and "consulting" (read: influence peddling) fees. I can't say I know this to be their view, but they *are* acting as though they'd just as soon leave the Democratic Party in tatters unless Hillary Clinton is the nominee. They have *always* looked first to their own advantage ... and don't you think they'd benefit more from four years of John McCain than they would from a term or two of Barack Obama? Food for thought, at least.

Posted by: Mark Durham | Feb 19, 2008 2:12:39 PM

While I am not thrilled with all the creativity the Clinton camp is floating in the media as ways for Hillary to get the nomination, I can understand the Clinton's frustration. Obama is nothing more than a well intentioned great public speaker who has no idea what he is getting himself into. Hillary Clinton has far more experience and will be a much strong President in a time of crisis like today. Instead, voters seem to be throwing out common sense by voting for a man with no plan and the media is in love with Obama also, so he gets a free pass on everything he says and does. Obama will be crushed to bits by Republican attacks and would much better serve the country as Vice President to Clinton, who can handle the Republican attack machine. My hope is voters wake up before it's too late and we end up with President McCain!

Posted by: Ryan Healey | Feb 19, 2008 2:10:09 PM

I agree with you Jake! And also Pogo: "We have met the enemy and he is us."

They really don't care about the voters, so they? It's just some sort of a game to them. What exactly do they have at stake that it could possibly be worth destroying the Democratic Party?

Posted by: Tom J | Feb 19, 2008 2:04:58 PM

Hillary is loved by every animal and human being; she is kind and emotional.
She deserves to be in the white house as her husband has been and she is superior and wicked and looser.

Posted by: ed | Feb 19, 2008 2:03:03 PM

Shirley,
Clinton smears herself with no help from anyone else. She is the most power mongering, pure unadulterated evil politician since Richard Nixon; only Juan McInsane comes close.

America will be in danger of being destroyed under a Hildebeest Klintoon presidency, just was it nearly was until Jerry Ford helped save the country.

Posted by: Guilden_NL | Feb 19, 2008 1:59:28 PM

The lesser of two evils, sad how election after election we are not capable of nominating canidates for public office with some integrity and records to back it up. I for one find it sad that anyone can beleive the statements made by any of the major canidates when the evidence, public record, clearly paints a much different picture than those stated in the speeches and policy statements. The 2008 Democratic convention will make the 68 look like a lovefest and all by the rules.

Posted by: poppatml | Feb 19, 2008 1:52:25 PM

Just heard it on the radio - the Clinton Camp has issued a statement saying they'll NOT be going after delegates pledged to Obama.
Just wish I could believe this was their view prior to the furor the story unleashed - still, a bit of a positive sign -

Posted by: Steve T. | Feb 19, 2008 1:43:46 PM

Who says the world loves Obama?

Chinese hate to see Obama win. They have decided to inject half a billion dolla to HRC campaign, because that family has been the best for China and Chinese immigrants getting jobs etc..

The Chines worry that Senator Obama might change the existing free entrance of Chinese workers to USA in favor of Maericans who need jobs and growth.

First of all, China is does not determine this election! Secondly, foreign countries CANNOT contribute money to the candidates. IT IS ILLEGAL!! But, then again, the CLINTONS DO NOT ABIDE BY THE RULES. I see poisonous snakes crawling out of HIllary's and Bill's mouth, nose, ears, and eyes. They are corrupt, loathsome, and viscious! Their campaign teams are just as bad.

Castro has stepped down as President of Cuba and as Chief of the Cuban Military Forces. He said he wants a younger generation to lead his country. For all of his dictatorship and notoriety, he has the vision and the understanding that perhaps his own leadership methods are no longer what Cuba needs. Hillary should follow suit.

Posted by: NinaK | Feb 19, 2008 1:39:29 PM

If Hillary wins nomination with superdelgates help or by pulling pledged delegates which Barack has already won, my vote will go to McCain. Hillary cannot win against McCain. Independents like me will have hard time voting for her. I would definitely vote for Obama over McCain. I have a feeling that all her experience is just talk, becuase she did not bring universal health care in 1994. What makes you think she will do it if she becomes president? She is sold. Insurance companies nad drug companies baught her. Baseless charges of plagiarism shows her desparation

Posted by: Mka | Feb 19, 2008 1:39:26 PM

Republican for Obama,
I too agree with you 1000%! It's amazing that some Dems (Hildebeest backers) can't understand why Republicans can't stand McCain and absolutely loath Clinton with every fiber in our bodies. Gee, then you have a guy that's coming in like a breath of fresh air.

I don't agree with many of Obama's policies as they stand, but believe that he's going to have to (as well as being willing to) work with Congress to get initiatives going.

So I too, am a GOPer that has never voted for a Dem but will vote for Obama. He MUST keep the Hildebeest off of the ticket though - NO VP slot for her!!!!!!!! Otherwise, it's third party for me.

Posted by: Guilden_NL | Feb 19, 2008 1:34:43 PM

Commander Guy - Gore did not use the courts, he only responded to a lawsuit in which BUSH was the plaintiff. The plaintiff is the person who institutes the suit.

Check the facts.

Posted by: Catpurrson | Feb 19, 2008 1:34:29 PM

My respect for both of the Clintons diminishes every day. I've always said that I would support whoever won the Democratic nomination because the last 8 years of Republicans has been a disaster for this country.

However, Clinton's latest tactics have me rethinking my position. If Obama does not win the nomination, I won't vote for McCain (that's worse that Hillary), but will cast my vote for the Green Party candidate.

Posted by: Catpurrson | Feb 19, 2008 1:31:10 PM

As I see it the problem we have is that we have eliminated other voices so quickly that we are left with the loudest, most strident, slickest, and often the most unfit candidates. As Americans we need to start at the bottom and clean up our state legislatures and the U.S.Senate and House and do it every election cycle. Change will only come when the Washington insiders are outside. Then maybe when we have another presidential election we will have several new contenders with new voices not just one newer voice and two "old" pros and political "dirty" business as usual.

Posted by: melinda | Feb 19, 2008 1:29:33 PM

Count me as an enthusiastic GOP voter for Obama in two weeks. I'll stick with MCain in November, but the sooner HRC is off the national stage, the better.

Posted by: Dan | Feb 19, 2008 1:24:10 PM

To "Spock":

Oh I do not lie...I have always voted Republican in the past. But, now I AM VOTING FOR, CONTRIBUTING TO, AND PRECINT CAPTAIN FOR OBAMA!

Texas will be a lot of fun this year. There are so many of us that despise Bill and Hillary Clinton. Alot of us Republicans look at McCain as more of the same...so it really isn't that far of a reach when you think about it now is it.

Posted by: Republican Voter for Obama | Feb 19, 2008 1:22:36 PM

Stealing votes is political coup which happens in Kenya, in Nicaragua, in Sadamm's Iraq, in Iran, in Cuba, ...


Now in Hillary's America, stealing votes is OK??

Clinton's campaign is getting sicker by the minute.

I consider voting for Hillary the same as voting for G.W.Bush in 2004.

The Clintons = The Bushes.

Posted by: Charlie | Feb 19, 2008 1:09:55 PM

Stealing votes is political coup which happens in Kenya, in Nicaragua, in Sadamm's Iraq, in Iran, in Cuba, ...


Now in Hillary's America, stealing votes is OK??

Clinton's campaign is getting sicker by the minute.

I consider voting for Hillary the same as voting for G.W.Bush in 2004.

The Clintons = The Bushes.

Posted by: Adam | Feb 19, 2008 1:08:34 PM

I was for Hillary at the beginning of the primaries. Now i think I'd vote republican if Obama doesn't get the nomination. I don't like her negative politics. I've never voted republican but I will if I have to in order to vote against her.

Posted by: Jason | Feb 19, 2008 1:06:08 PM

Something is just too fishy with the Clinton couple, actually many things. Anyway, we had enough family dynasties in the Oval-Office! For those few remaining misguided individuals: Please stop supporting the Clinton's.

Posted by: Concerned | Feb 19, 2008 1:02:53 PM

Republican Voter for Obama - Why do you lie? No Republican will ever vote for Obama, he is further left then Hilary!!

Posted by: spock | Feb 19, 2008 12:57:26 PM

What bugs me about both Clintons (mayber Hill more than Bill) is not so much their policies. I get the sense from their track record of arrogant actions that they feel they are so important to the future that they cannot allow any rule or custom to stand between them and what they desire. If they did, it would be a betrayal of the future. These sorts always screw things up because they try to bring about the impossible, thinking that it is only impossible for OTHERS, not them.
People keep calling the Obama campaign messianic, but that's just celebrity. Clinton is the real political messiah in her own mind.

Posted by: Dennymack | Feb 19, 2008 12:51:16 PM

I've always voted Republican. I don't believe that Ohio's Republicans are voting for Hillary. All my Republican friends are voting FOR MCCAIN or OBAMA. But HILLARY...NO!

There is still this man called Huckabee that is embarrassing McCain just a little. They have a pretty heated little battle going on on their side...NO REPUBLICAN WILL WASTE A VOTE FOR HILLARY. Maybe that would be a strategy later in the primaries, but not now.

Posted by: Republican Voter for Obama | Feb 19, 2008 12:50:28 PM

Hillary is lame and has lost WI, TX. OH and HI. Just grab a cold one sit back and watch it unravel.


America for Obama!!!

Posted by: terry | Feb 19, 2008 12:48:56 PM

Virginia Governor and Richmond Mayor Douglas Wilder predicted chaos, not riots. Isn't that what one has when "all the rules go out the window"?

The truth is that rules are not going to go out the window. The Clinton campaign is merely trying to sow uncertainty in an electorate that is pretty sure it doesn't want her. Clinton clearly understands the power of mere words, but is using them for evil rather than for good.

Posted by: AgathaX | Feb 19, 2008 12:46:28 PM

Rules apply to everybody...but if you are a CLINTON RULES APPLY TO EVERYBODY ELSE! It is stupid for any campaign to say all rules go out the window.

Remember America, everyone around the world is watching this election. Whoever emerges as our President will face world leaders across a negotiating table at some time. A little self respect, decorum and character would be a real good thing to have.

Just say NO TO CLINTON DIRTY POLITICS...Just say YES to OBAMA.

Posted by: Rules Apply to Everybody | Feb 19, 2008 12:42:49 PM

Please get it right, these are the rules! Hillary is not going to let the Obama people steal this nomination from here. Super delegates will decide this election just as the rules allow.

Posted by: cv | Feb 19, 2008 12:42:12 PM

Who says the world loves Obama?

Chinese hate to see Obama win. They have decided to inject half a billion dolla to HRC campaign, because that family has been the best for China and Chinese immigrants getting jobs etc..

The Chines worry that Senator Obama might change the existing free entrance of Chinese workers to USA in favor of Maericans who need jobs and growth.

Posted by: aswego | Feb 19, 2008 12:40:23 PM

If Obama continues his current lead in pledged voters he will be able to magnanimously sit the Florida and Michigan delegates and STILL have the most pledged delegates (though it will be much closer). Right now, even including Florida and even giving him NONE of the 40% of uncommitted Michigan delegates or votes (which he would likely get at the convention), Obama still has a lead in pledged delegates, popular votes, and states won. The only lead Hillary has is in superdelegates and that gap is closing fast. (And they won't vote against a resounding 3-front popular victory like that) So, c'mon America, just keep giving Obama landslides and we won't have to worry about "tearing the Democratic party apart" at the convention or repeating Gore v Bush and we can have a Democratic candidate who was elected--not just by Iowa and New Hampshire and not by inevitability or inertia--but by an informed and energized electorate that spans the entire country. Now wouldn't that be cool?

Posted by: S. L. | Feb 19, 2008 12:40:17 PM

Dear Hillary,

Thanks for doing the one thing that McCain couldn't do by himself: persuading me to vote for anybody but Hillary and if that means McCain in the fall, so be it. There's no point in electing a Democrat if she's just as low down and skuzzy as a Republican; might as well get the real thing.

Posted by: windrider | Feb 19, 2008 12:40:07 PM

Does it bother anyone as to how the media portrays Obama versus Hillary?

He is shown as a super-clean, super-hero. A man who can do no wrong.

She is shown as a villain. A woman who is obsessed with power and will do anything to win.

Look at their respective pictures in news articles. She has her mouth open and her eyes bulging out. He is always calm and presidential.

Come on guys wake-up. Nobody is saying that Hillary is an angel. But neither is she the monster that the media is portraying her as. She is a tough and smart woman. Her husband was the president for 8 years and a pretty good president (forget his personal life). She is ready on day one and that is what this country needs to put things back on track.

My humble opinion!!

Posted by: SS_FAPS | Feb 19, 2008 12:34:48 PM

flyover says "The comments about the Clintons -- right on. But Obama? So far to the left that if he had his way he would institute a socialist regime on his first day. If I had to vote for either one of those turkeys, I have to kill myself. So I'll hold my nose and vote for McCain.
Conservatives, you dropped the ball on this one."
- Oh yeah. The right-wing conservatives and their big-business consituancy have the country in FINE shape - for a FEW!
That's the whole point here. That's why Clinton's waging a campaign and Obama's leading a movement!


Posted by: Steve T. | Feb 19, 2008 12:34:44 PM

If all the Obama supporters had real faith in their candidate, they might not see this as a threat. The problem for them and Obama is Republicans won't have to play dirty games this time around. The choice is clear. Predicting a squeaker with Mccain the victor.

Posted by: Kitty | Feb 19, 2008 12:33:23 PM

Not to mention the Congressional and judicial power grabs...Right commander?
GBU GBA

Posted by: flyover | Feb 19, 2008 12:29:46 PM

The comments about the Clintons -- right on. But Obama? So far to the left that if he had his way he would institute a socialist regime on his first day. If I had to vote for either one of those turkeys, I have to kill myself. So I'll hold my nose and vote for McCain.
Conservatives, you dropped the ball on this one.

Posted by: Coach B | Feb 19, 2008 12:28:55 PM

Power hungry Clinotns slush-'n-burn tectic again!

How undemocratic and SHAMEFUL for Hilary not able to win in election but to secure the nomination?

SHAME on you, Hilary!

Read the next headline, "Loosing, Hilary Style!".

Posted by: Joe Trader | Feb 19, 2008 12:28:06 PM

Die-hard republicans in Ohio are rooting (an possibly voting) for Clinton to win the democratic nomination, Clinton wins the democratic nomination through under-handed means, McCain wins the presidency in November. What a wonderful county we live in!!!

Posted by: Shawn | Feb 19, 2008 12:25:01 PM

Try it Clinton. Just try it.

Posted by: PulSamsara | Feb 19, 2008 12:24:58 PM

Wow, Clintons will do anything to grasp power. It's very alerming.

Posted by: TL | Feb 19, 2008 12:24:52 PM

Ty, I don't believe there wil be riots in the streets, but there willl be A LOT of angry Obama supporters, and they make up the majority of Dem voters. Remember, EVERY major poll finds McCain beating Hilda, but he loses to Obama. A vote for Hilda = McCain victory!

Posted by: bill | Feb 19, 2008 12:23:44 PM

Let me put it another way, by asking a rhetorical question:

Does behaving like a Republican (as I feel Senator Clinton is doing with respect to her campaign tactics) position us Democrats more or less favorably in a general election against a genuine Republican, *particularly* in a year which finds voters so desperately hungry for CHANGE away from Republicanism?

If one can only "win" by aping the appalling, despicable political tactics of Karl Rove, Lee Atwater and the Shifty Boat Liars, I fail to see how such a "victory" could prove to be anything but Pyhrric.

Posted by: Mark | Feb 19, 2008 12:23:36 PM

Who was the Senior Clinton Official? Politico.com has been a stanch Obama supporter for months now. Pledged Delegates can not in fact vote for who they want. That's why they are called pledged delegates. This is rubbish. But it's good to see Obamaphiles get soo riled up over a non-story.

Posted by: Kevin | Feb 19, 2008 12:21:26 PM

Clinton is a good candidate and would make a good president, but these tactics are alarming. We don't want a president who actively works against his/her constituents. Obama is far better candidate.

Posted by: Barry | Feb 19, 2008 12:15:51 PM

David repeats the oft-quoted Limbaugh canard, "for youre information this country is not a Democracy its a Republic."

That sounds somewhat cogent, but it's pure farce, designed to make the word "Republican" sound more American than the word "Democratic".

The Founders envisioned a democratic republic, in other words, a republican democracy.

"Republican" indicates that the nation is not a "monarchy". "Democracy" occurs when the will of the people is actualized.

Yes, we started out as a democratic republic, but the Republicans have replaced the will of the people with the will of the special interests and royal family oligarchs.

Sadly, today's Democrats are not all that democratic.

Money, or the lack of it, has corrupted the entire process. The Founders would not recognize the place.

Posted by: new_york_loner | Feb 19, 2008 12:09:53 PM

The Clintons, for good or evil, through the rules out the windows years ago. This is nothing new -- it's just the latest version of Clinton Opportunism.

Posted by: Killer of Giants | Feb 19, 2008 12:09:02 PM


If Mrs. Clinton steals the nomination (and that's the only way she will get it!); it will result in business as usual in Washington. Approval ratings of 30% for the Pres. and 20% for the "do nothing" Congress indicate the American people are sick of business as usual. Obama's positive message of change for the American people rings loud because it objects to the same old Washington politics. We need Obama in the White House and a wholesale removal of all the members of Congress as elections allow.
If Clinton is the nominee, we need the "American Party" with Obama and Bloomberg as Pres. and Veep.

Posted by: Angry American | Feb 19, 2008 12:03:23 PM

Well said, Steve T.

We can all now see with increasingly clarity how Clinton would operate as president, just as she's doing now toward her "friend" and "colleague," Senator Obama:

Smears, distortions, distrust, arrogance, condescension toward and contempt for those with whom she disagrees, a take-no-prisoners attitude, combined with classic zero-sum/scorched-earth politics, whisper campaigns, subterfuge, a Rove-like appeal to her "base" only, etc.

In other words, a recipe for GRIDLOCK, STALEMATE and ultimately, FAILURE. And all this presumes she can even beat McCain, which every poll I've seen thus far says she can't.

She'd have ZERO cooperation from Repubs, and only mild support from many Democrats, after having slashed and burned her way over her fellow Democrats to the White House.

THAT'S what we don't like about what we're seeing.

Posted by: Mark | Feb 19, 2008 12:02:28 PM

This is the most outrageously disgusting assault on our democracy I've seen! Karl Rove wouldn't even sink this low. The Clinton's don't care about the voters, they don't care about the Democratic Party, they don't care about America, or even democracy. They actually feel we all owe them our allegiance! And if we refuse, they'll do WHATEVER it takes to assume their rightful place in control of us! Obama has my vote, and if not him then McCain, I just pray my vote doesn't get bought off by the Clintons.

Posted by: Mark Morris | Feb 19, 2008 12:00:21 PM

An act of plagiarism is an act of plagiarism. An act of deceit is an act of deceit. An act of concealing truth is an act of concealing truth. An act of bombing belgrade during Good friday was an act of bombing people who were busy praying. Let us find a few good democrat by their act, not by thair talk.

Posted by: A concerned citizen | Feb 19, 2008 11:57:23 AM

Hillary's campaign just has me scratching my head these days. Meanwhile, Obama's campaign is very smart to lable her tactics as "win at all costs." It's no secret that democratic voters have long felt cheated since the Gore-Florida fiasco and there is an annoyance with Bush appearing the "win at all costs." Her tactics have allowed her to be aligned with simlar impressions that dems have toward the Bush administration. That's not good when you're seeking a dem nomination. She's shooting herself in the foot...practically giving Obama the race these days. It may not even make it to the delegates if she keeps this up.

Posted by: yo | Feb 19, 2008 11:57:15 AM

At least Hillary's camp is stating the rules will be off. Obama pulls the same strings, just behind everyone's back.

Posted by: MH | Feb 19, 2008 11:55:31 AM


flyover

Ah...flyover is civic minded and reminds us that a liberal consitutional democracy is a fragile form of government. Good for you fly.

See when people push teh Rules for short term (partisan) political gain (See HRC for this topic or GWB43 on Irak, executive power grabs, etc...) they can cause some serious mischief and even threaten our fragile system of govt.

The only break on the Rule Breakers is THE PEOPLE and the consent of the governed.

So you got the Democrat Pary (HRC)threatening to burn its own house down if that what it takes to win. You have the current whitehouse guy tellin the people he don't have to follow no stinking laws because his action are always, by definition, legal.

Yep plenty of blame to go around. And it us, we the people, that are responsible for cleaning up the mess.

Posted by: The Commander Guy | Feb 19, 2008 11:53:54 AM

I reject Hillary Clinton's presidential bid for ten good reasons:

1. Dynastic democracy sucks.

2. Bill would be a constant national distraction.

3. Gov. Spitzer, not the people of NY, would name her Senate replacement.

4. The Marc Rich pardon scandal and the quid pro quo that won the NYC Jewish vote for Hillary in 2000.

5. Hillary voted to invade Iraq.

6. Hillary voted for Kyl-Lieberman, needlessly provoking Iran.

7. Hillary missed the Mukasey confirmation vote.

8. Hillary missed the recent FISA vote.

9. Hillary takes special interest money from the War Lobby.

10. Hillary, our would-be Commander-In-Chief, has never served in the armed forces of the United States.

I could go on, but the bottom line is this - Mrs. Clinton is too gullible or too corrupt to lead the nation at this critical moment in history.

Posted by: new_york_loner | Feb 19, 2008 11:53:49 AM

I've considered myself a democrat for as long as I can remember and have been happy to place my vote because I belive more in character that party. Should I be put in a position where Hillary is the nominee, my vote will go for McCain!

Posted by: Walt Harris | Feb 19, 2008 11:53:36 AM

We have rules in this country and for youre information this country is not a Democracy its a Republic. The rule was set and any delagate can change if he wants .

Posted by: David | Feb 19, 2008 11:52:44 AM

I really was pretty neutral toward Hillary before she actually started her campaign. The more I hear out of her, the less I like her.

At this point, if she wins the nomination, McCain's getting my vote.

Posted by: Nate | Feb 19, 2008 11:51:25 AM

Obama has positioned himself as the man for 'change and hope' (In New Orleans they can certainly tell him that 'Hope' is not a plan). Now he backslides on public finance for the elections if he is the nominee against McCain - who says he isn't for more of the same? He prides himself with his silver tongue and asks 'are words not important?' Yet these arent't even his words and those he quotes eg, FDR, backed his rhetoric with substantive and comprehensive plans (see last week's The Economist). Is his recent 'Patriot Employer' economic plan rolled out in Wisconsin a portend of things to come? Democratic economists are baffled by this as i