Political Punch

Would someone please interview a group of Iraq war vets to determine if the usage of drugs to regulate "combat effectiveness" causes them long-term emotional distress? I have heard from some soldiers of their access to meds to "make them more alert" for combat patrols and to "bring them down again" during down time. Many have reported sleeping disorders and aggression issues. Where does PTSD begin and drug dependency end? Is the military guilty of providing these drugs, or are they just indifferent to their usage? Could this be one factor of so many suicides?

It is sad, we need to stand by our soldiers becasue they are the real Heros, not some football player who only looses a few dollars if he misses a kick or other celebrity!

I think the number of suicides is extremely exaggerated though by the hate America group.

But I do agree knowing what was done under the Democrats reigns in office since FDR with using untested drugs on our soldiers their needs to be a full investigation into it.

Going to Iraq should not need as many drugs as was needed in Vietnam or other jungle areas.

Instead of Drugs the congress should give money for protective gear and detection equipment!

It hardly makes sense for people to complain about the war if these same complaining people are willing to benefit from living in the United States and to use oil that doesn't belong to them, drive cars bought on credit, have electric, and the like, because these very same soldiers are out there defending their way of life, the American way of life.

A very small few are paying the price for you and I to enjoy the luxury of the American life.

The blood and the minds of all who died, both American and Iraqi, and others are on our hands.

The papers should read a human being killed another human being today; not as they do: Four Americans were killed today, or four insurgents were killed by American soldiers.

These labels dehumanize the entire fact that humans are killing other humans under the orders of a government who had the PEOPLE in the US elect him.

People put the president into office. People RE-ELECTED this very same president. People elected the members of congress who gave this president authority over this matter.

It surely isn't Bush's fault alone, it is the fault of those who elected him, those who gave him authority, and so forth.

I am thankful beyond measure for the soldiers, under orders by their government, who are sacrificing their lives, health, and families for me.

Seems like we can't finish one mess before we start more sabre rattling.

Hillary goes around saying we will OBLITHERATE Iran. She thinks we need to go back to Cold War strategy. The Cold War included a military comprised of DRAFTED young men. Of course, Bill avoided that by a quick trip to Canada.

The circus of Clinton's campaign with statements like this and her Bosnia sniper fire are making a mockery of this country's military. Then she goes on Jay Leno and just laughs off the Bosnia lie.

That just can't have a positive affect on the already worn out men and women with repeated tours of duty in Iraq and Afghanistan.

Now this is what we should be worried about. Not the stupid gas tax holiday or preachers or fake Bosnia stories.

This is real people and with the troup rotation there is way too much on these young men and women.

Belle:

Thanks for the clarification! Looks like we agree on something (besides that Edwards should have stayed in the race)!

That's why the Republicans are scared to death of a draft!!! Unfortunately, our military men and women have suffered the most (along with the Iraqi people).

Obama 2008 -- Yes, WE CAN!!!

We never take care of our vets and the vacination's some are not even FDA aproved my son has his blood taken every six months and has had many problems since the first gulf war he refuses to go to the VA because it is in bad shape and to see a Dr. can take all day. He has his own insurance.thank god I have heard there are nearly seven thousand suicides.

Jackt51 writes:
"Belle, could you explain this comment?"

What part of it possibly requires an explanation? Why wait around to have your legs blown off, when what you signed up for was some weekend camaraderie and to defend the State of Iowa?

I'd tell him to get OUT of there, Jack.

ESPECIALLY if he isn't thinking clearly. The Congress wasn't thinking so clearly when they let Dub kidnap the National Guard from the states, instead of instituting a draft.

If there WERE a draft, the criminal assault on Iraq would have ended long ago.

Belle Starr said:
"If he were MY brother, I think I'd counsel him to borrow a burqa and head for Sweden."

Belle, could you explain this comment?

Obama 2008 -- Yes, WE CAN!!!

"It's quite possible that the suicides and psychiatric mortality of this war could trump the combat deaths."

And it's quite possible that monkeys might emerge from my posterior and do aerial acrobatics. Possible, but certainly not likely.

It takes as little as 30 days and never more than 60 days of full-time combat to stress a soldier into a PSTD state - whether they come back out of it OK is *solely* dependent how regularly they receive R&R and medical attention, and how short or limited the repeat tours are.

The only soldiers who do not have this problem are those that are diagnosable as psychopathic or sociopathic! This comes directly from US Army research and operating manuals!!

Asymmetric combat *is* 24x7, full-time combat therefore pretty much *all* soldiers are into PSTD territory in this war. Add to the fact that this is probably the worst ever PSTD scenario because it's the most asymmetric conflict since Vietname or the Filipino-American war.

We've summarily applied stop-loss and repeat tours that in direct violation of scientifically proven anti-PSTD operating procedures it's hardly surprising that suicides and PSTD are observed and predicted to reach catastrophic levels.

There have been many atrocities in this war; this happens to be one committed against our own troops.

Becky writes:
"My brother is Iowa National Guard, he is not the same.
Sometimes I think all the shots they had to have before leaving is not helping with this. They had to have shots to keep their bodies cool because of the heat, shots for amtheraxe (not sure the spelling). Anyway, 3 weeks out of all the shot he had to take for 6 months before leaving he got very forgetful, he could not remember anything short term. Scared us all."

If he were MY brother, I think I'd counsel him to borrow a burqa and head for Sweden.

Google video "Beyond Treason" and see what the troops who are fortunate to survive will face if they ever come home. Between depleted uranium and bathing with open wounds in utreated RAW SEWAGE, I think we are giving our troops a RAW DEAL and need to bring them HOME to protect our border and OUR country. But then again if you've never had a family member in the Armed Forces, or are unwilling to send your own child or even yourself to fight in a foreign war you claim to "support", then I guees your perfectly fine with forwarding your agenda with empty platitudes while civillians and soldiers alike are made to pay the ultimate sacrifice, with no mental or medical care should they be one who is fortunate enough to survive. Iraq vets have exposed their own family members to DU, a soldiers wife, husband or child never asked to sacrifice years off their lives to the fight in Iraq or the coming IRAN war. How can anybody justify calling these brave men and women's own familes to untimely deaths... Is there ANY humanity left in this country???

Okay, let's try this again. Apparently the censors didn't approve of my first post -- can't for the life of me figure out why!

I can't fault Hillary Clinton on this issue, other than for having voted for the war.

McCain, on the other hand, continues to show he is no friend to Veterans by not supporting legislation to help returning Iraq/Afghanistan veterans.

The problems faced by returning veterans can certainly be traced largely to the nature of this war, and particularly to the endless tours of duty and stop-loss, etc.

Vietnam Veterans faced similar problems on returning home, but for us the problems largely went untreated by the VA until years after the war was over. The VA constantly ignored and berated Vietnam Veterans for their problems. That didn't begin to change until the late 1970s, when the combination of the Carter Administration, with Max Cleland as VA Administrator, the then-fledgling Vietnam Veterans of America and other Vietnam Veterans organizations such as VVAW, NACV, etc. and the Vietnam Veterans Memorial combined to change public opinion and congressional mindsets.

While we're hearing about these problems much earlier -- and these issues HAVE been getting considerable press -- the Bush Administration has not done much to make the needed changes, lest they have to admit their approach to the war was wrong. And it's unlikely that would change considerably under McBush.

Only a new Democratic Administration will truly work to change the situation for returning Iraq War veterans. First, by bringing the troops home, and then by accepting American responsiblility for dealing with the problems created by the war, providing the care needed to heal the physical and emotional wounds of veterans and their families.

Obama 2008 -- Yes, WE CAN!!!

Irish Gram writes:
"America sends their best and brightest to an illegal and immoral war, then does not help them enough when they return home."

Well, THIS time, they mostly sent kids who were lured in by promises of education and so on. An "all-volunteer" force (they don't mention the equal number of better-paid mercenaries) doesn't even have as clear a claim to care as the Viet Nam draftees did -- and many of THEM wound up in the streets.

Just what they're intending to do with hundreds of thousands of these guys is a little puzzling -- surely they aren't ALL going into the police. National health would be a start, maybe.

Irish gram,

I agree with you. The Vietnam vets have been around since the '60's, untreated for the most part. No one cared ENOUGH. Despite substantial and chronic exposure to Agent Orange, with increases in neurological abnormalities and diabetes, the federal government has failed to act. I know two Vietnam vets who are bing "monitored" for agent orange exposure. Note, there is no real test for this so essentially the federal government, through the VA, sees them and collects data. That does these guys no good.

Perhaps this time we can make sure the vets are diagnosed and treated at least.

The media should have been looking into this a long time ago. America sends their best and brightest to an illegal and immoral war, then does not help them enough when they return home. This has happened before with Viet Nam troops (my husband was there)and other military actions. War is Hell. Bring our troops home.

My brother is Iowa National Guard, he is not the same.
Sometimes I think all the shots they had to have before leaving is not helping with this. They had to have shots to keep their bodies cool because of the heat, shots for amtheraxe (not sure the spelling). Anyway, 3 weeks out of all the shot he had to take for 6 months before leaving he got very forgetful, he could not remember anything short term. Scared us all.

I am tired of the Elitist Crap!

Clinton doesn't have the moral courage to be President. She is a spineless Panderer. Neither does the press.

jgaw,

And I would add, JFK put increased the troops substantially in Vietnam and was not in favor of a pullout:

"It was JFK who increased America's troop number from 500 to 16,000 and he repeatedly insisted that while Vietnam might have been "in the final analysis, their war," American troops were nontheless not there "to see a war lost" and that he totally disagreed with those who were suggesting the idea of a pullout. "I think that would be a mistake," he said to Walter Cronkite in 1963."

Hillary the Bosnian General has authorized the war in Irak and has authorized WBush to use military force against the Iranian Revolutionary Guard. Leadership is about moral responsibilty and putting young women and men in a harmful way should not be a light decision as McCain and Hillary have done by voting to support WBush in declaring war in Irak and allowing the use of force against Iran. Hill said that US will obliterate Iran when it attacks Israel. What a mediocrity in leadership. Thousands of veterans who are suffering today should be a good lesson for any leader who cares, but Hill and McCain are careless leaders. God save America from Hill and McCain, God bless America and God bless Obama. OBAMA08.

Stunning. We need a national debate on how best to help these vets. Obviously, we aren't doing enough.

Thanks for bringing it to light, Jake.

Yes Sen Clintion was lied to with the rest of the Country, but I seem to remember that I did not buy into it. I opposed this war, why didn't Hillary? She had access to a lot more information then I did, oh, but she didn't bother to look at it did she.

Bet she was pandering for votes when she voted for this war. She and all of Congress sold out all of these men and women.

They will give us lip service. They have not supported these troops with equipment, or the man power required to wage the war and keep the peace.

Vote for Hillary, she will get us out? This nothing but BS, she nor the majority of Congress deserve our votes.

This is what bothers me is that folks and their children and the majority of American voters have never served.

They all talk patriotism, and flag pins, and invoke God, and vote for the same spineless individuals who put us in the mess to begin with.

Sorry, this is one issue I can't get Democratic partisan about. Hillary may have voted for the War, and that's one reason I like Obama more, but I have no doubt whatsoever that her decision on that vote was a mistake.

She has all the information now, as do we all, and there's no doubt she's committed to ending the war.

I'll dig into her with gusto, and I even did earlier today over the Iraq war, but on reflection (and more than a few deep breaths) I have to admit that on most issues, either Dem will excel in place of McCain.

"Hilliary voted for the war so she'll be the one to get us out?" Haven't the last eight years or sixteen if you count Bill taught us ANYTHING!!! The 1st thing a politician (Bush, Clinton, Nixon) does when they make a big mistake is double down and ratchet up the intensity in the same (wrong) direction. Hilliary will NOT pull out troops. Obama wants to shift them into Afghanistan. McCain wants to occupy Iraq for 100 years. And Hilliary is for the status quo. It would take six months to a year to pull out everybody and our equipment out of Iraq if they decided to do it TODAY! Were not leaving Iraq, we're gonna invade IRAN. You think Obama or Hilliary are gonna pull troops out of IRAN once we start fighting there? HELL NO! They'll be forced to "continue the fight", just like Bush has done in Iraq. Once you invade, you can NOT put the genie back in the bottle. Admiral Fallon knew that, that's why he refused to go into Iran and was fired. Wake up people. Left-right is a FALSE paradigm. They are simply playing the game of divide and conquer, while the underlying policy NEVER changes. WAKE UP!!! Turn off your tv and use alternative media, there the only real source you will have for seeking the truth. Corporate controlled media is owned by military contractors. They're FOR more WAR!!!

thinking, you are not thinking,
sen. clinton did not deliver this war.
but she will end it responsibly
and if you want to get back into all of that, obama voted to cont to fund the war.
and if he had been in the sen. to vote he would have voted right along with everyone else.

he likes to accept the thought that someone would see him as jfk, but if you look at his voting record
he has shown no "profile in courage"

obama is no jfk.
sen. clinton will help end the war

"We need to elect someone who is enough of a FIGHTER to be able to end the fight in iraq. Hillary. Obama will um er um about it and equivocate as usual."

Well, Al, since McBush has made it clear he has no intention in ending the Iraq War at any time in the future, I guess I'll go with someone you say is wishy-washy but at least they want to get us out of Iraq.

Yes Sen Clinton delivered the war!

just as one of the earlier comments listed, sen. clinton was LIED to also about this was, as well as the rest of the gov. and citizens.
sen. clinton will bring the troops home responsibly and take care of them with the healthcare plan.
and also on this healthcare deal.
I don't think anyone believes for a minute-if sen. clinton does not get the nomination, she will stop fighting for universal healthcare.
I think until her last breath she will be fighting for that for the citizens of this country. because it is the right thing to do.

Does anyone recall the commission under Bush in 2004 recommending closure of VA hospitals?? Many did close.

Some veterans (Vietnam era) I know travel a couple of humdred miles each way to get to a VA. Vietnam era vets have suffered from PTSD for how many years now? We see them everyday in the criminal justice system and shelters.

VA hospitals have been on the cutting edge of research and treatment for PTSD. I had occasion to research this back in the late '90's. Not sure if that is still the case, but I bet it is. That is probably why this latest report states that half the vets now were "inadequately" treated. Most hospitals and medical profs. really are not trained in the treatment and diagnosis.

Instead of closing VA's, they should be maintaining them and making them accessible for the returning vets.

Consider the nature of this war (urban) and the fact that they are being sent back for multiple tours. After Viet Nam we had a rough time with the troops returning to a country unprepared to accept them. Two of those were my older brothers and the variation of reactions is quite wide and not something covered by the terms used here.

A LOT of things will happen. This isn't something the military can do on its own. Families have to prepare, neighborhoods, churches, and so on. This is where ABC can help us out. How about a series (not blipverts but in depth) explaining how best to go about this.

My neighbor's son committed suicide within a month of returning. No one was ready or knew how to prepare.

Help us, ABC. This isn't political. This is about what we owe them.

al writes:
"We need to elect someone who is enough of a FIGHTER to be able to end the fight in iraq. Hillary. Obama will um er um about it and equivocate as usual."

Yet another reason to nominate John Edwards, the guy who's smart enough to prevail against whomever the Republican nominee REALLY turns out to be -- someone who might NOT have McCain's "hundred years" outlook. Remember Nixon's "secret plan" to end the war in Viet Nam? It got him elected.

I would like the ones who voted for this war man and woman to go over and stay for one month and see how they do .These peple need help and need to come home.I just heard Hilly now agrees that they troops should stay there,
( how true this is I don't know) A waste of life both on the front and at home.was not needed.......

Let's remember who voted for this war

yes, we are so caught up in the dems battle-the war to win is in the fall.
against the rep.
for me a third reason is-I am sure I will NOT like the person(s) mccain will appt. to supreme court.

for everyone who says they will not vote if there person does not get it
that is as good as a vote for mccain.

so dems one and all vote.

the black people will fall in line with sen. clinton when she is nominated,
don't worry-black people want to have jobs healthcare and work also.
sen. clinton will deliver

The two drop dead reasons why we must elect a Dem and not McCain:

1) we must end the Iraq war responsibly and McCain is committed to more of the same and

2) we must stop subsidizng the rich and bring relief to the middle/working class and McCain is committed to keeping Bush's tax cuts for the wealthy.

of course, a lot of people say this is mccains strongest area, I have read about his stance with the vets. deplorable.
so with mccains healthcare plan he would not even be able to get the cancer tx he needs.
and if he were a vet coming home from was he would not be care for half as well as he was taken care of.

I know you are an obama guy.
and I for sen.clinton.
either one will hammer this home in the fall.

The fact remains the only candidate who's against ending this thing in Iraq is McCain. He'll have us there for years and years into the future. All the while, holding back vet services funding for the soldiers who are victimized by his immoral war.

Again, no matter which Dem you support, it's clear how they'll unify the party after the nomination is won. I'd vote for just about any Dem who was willing to defy McBush on this Iraq issue.

Jgaw -

I'm an Obama guy, but you're right about praising Clinton for that. All the Dems are fighting McCain right now in his resistence to expanding benefits and funding for vets.

Can you beleive McCain is also against giving comparable benefits to reservist vets that our other troops already receive? Right in line with Bush on that one.

How can these sick men send our reservists into tour after tour into harms way, but not serve them equally with help and benefits on their return?

Talk about unpatriotic.

sen. clinton is a part of the everybody
she will bring the troops home responsibily.

"20 percent of US veterans back from Iraq and Afghanistan have symptoms of post traumatic stress disorder or major depression ... Only a little more than half, however, have sought treatment."

Well, "seeking treatment" ought to finish off quite a few, given that the only "treatment" most of them will ever get will be creepy pharmaceuticals.

Those who are savvy enough NOT to seek treatment, of course, can always become ... cops.

Barack picks up 9 more Super Delegates today. Hillary is toast.

Geevil -

No-one's saying they gave their life for nothing. They are accusing the Bush Administration and his Party for the string of lies and incompetencies that have lead to far more deaths than ever should have been.

If the war was illegal, ALL of the reasons for going there have been proven to be lies and mistakes, and at almost every turn, every decision, every strategy, the administration has been WRONG at best and Criminally neglegent and willfully misleading at worst, how is it that opposition to it is a left-wing agenda?

EVERYONE in America was lied to. It's everyone's govermnet that has been highjacked. It's everyone's military service personnel that have been shamelessly undersupplied and killed executing Bush's failed plans. It's everyone's civil rights that have been violated by the administration.

Republican citizens should be just as outraged as Democrats. They should be voting for Obama or Clinton in droves to send that message to their party.

This isn't about Left or Right. It's about right and wrong.

Thank goodness, sen. clinton, has always and continues to make the point about mental health when she talks about her healthcare plan.

What a terrible tragedy both in terms of those killed and those who have been gravely wounded either physically or psychologically. And Petraeus still can't say that what we're doing in Iraq is making us safer! Hillary will wrap it up and bring our troops home in a competent, prudent way. McCain promises us more of the same, and Obama promises us weak kneed withdrawal. Only Hillary can do this careful balancing act and bring our troops home!!

Sorry. We are not leftwingers using the tragedy to promote a peacenik far left agenda. Perhaps if people like Obama were not out there saying they gave their life for nothing.

Support the troops, BRING THEM HOME!!!

We get so caught up in debating the Dem Primary, we need articles like this to remind us why we're so passionate about going against the Republicans. I may think aweful things about Hillary, and others say the same about Obama, but they've got nothing on the reckoning coming to the Republicans for their sins in starting and promoting this war. All of these lives are on their heads.

Vote Democrate, Hillary or Obama, no matter what. A vote for the Republicans is a reward and an endorsement for the nightmare that this article just scratches the surface on.

Finally a story about substance. This needs to be brought to the forefront of media coverage. Of the many, many atrocities we have experienced since the start of this condemnable war, this is one we can do something about!