Political Punch

I find it interesting and hypocritical that the conservative right is backing John McCain after his cameo appearance in the movie, ”Wedding Crashers” which was criticized by movie critics for repeated excessive nudity. McCain made no apologies for it and actually joked about it on Jay Leno stating, “"In Washington, I work with boobs every day.”

How is it that the conservative right has turned their heads from this and pretend it never happened? They point out McCain’s values and morals and this diabolical appearance is in direct opposition to Christian values. I bet if Obama had appeared in such a raunchy movie, the conservative right would criticize him for amoral and indecent behavior. I am a Christian and I am appalled John McCain would appear in such a movie and turn around and run for the office of president.

Isn’t it interesting how the conservative right pick and choose their values, whenever it suits them best. Thanks for pretending McCain has done nothing wrong, so you can keep a tight grip on your taxes. And by the way; doesn’t it give you an out for voting for that black guy? It’s no wonder the world think we are a bunch of hypocrites because we are. I can’t in good conscience vote for either one of them.

I don't think the view that slaves were actual human beings is now in question...however, the idea that an unborn fetus that can't survive outside its mother's body is another story. It's not murder if the mother miscarries. Not even manslaughter. The idea that independent life begins at conception is a BELIEF and not a fact. Those who think that is the deal breaker will certainly not vote for Obama...but not every Catholic (surprise) thinks its a deal breaker.

I am also not a Catholic anymore because of the attitude that we should vote based on one issue: abortion.
Never mind that McCain wants to continue the Iraq debacle for another 50 years,(do the 80,000 Iraq citizens who have died and the thousands maimed count?) or keep the tax breaks for his wealthy friends (while more poor Americans go hungry as food prices rise, don't the poor need a bigger tax break more?)or not have any plan for reasonably priced health insurance available to all Americans, (how many children or their mom or dad dies because they don't get medical care or medicine soon enough, do their lives count?) It seems morally insane to care about the lives of those who aren't here more than caring for those who are here now and need our help desperately.

I was baptized a Catholic.

Ben said "if the cadidate proposes things that go against God's will, then he's not the man for the job. "

I agree and this is why I can not vote for John McCaine as he is an admits he has repeatedly engaged in adultery. This is a violation of the one of the 10 commandments.

To vote for someone engaging in this kind of behavior is to condone and advance the practice in society. I shall not cast away either my vote or my soul so carelessly.

Besides, I am near retirement and McCane promises to eliminate social security and medicaid, before I even collect my first check. I don't have any other retirement income.

He says he wants to use the money to support an extension of tax breaks for the wealth and to continue the war. Why should I vote for someone who wants to rip me off to support his lobbyist friends and his pet projects? I live on less than $20,000/year already and the price of things get more expensive every day. Why would I want to vote for a continuation of policies that will only make things even more expensive?

@carolyn: The Pope has come out and told catholics to vote against abortion. That's coming from the top. No Trinity Church or childish assumptions needed.

Posted by: X marks the spot | Jul 9, 2008 3:54:52 PM

The Pope has also called for stopping the war. Which candidate is more determined to end the war? Which is more setermined to continue it?

Rev Mahoney,

You're response would have more impact if you included the name of the group that printed it.

The Religious Right are neither

I am responding to your July 8 blog, Conservative Christian Group Invokes Slavery in Opposing Obama. You mention a piece of literature called, "An appeal to Catholics Regarding the 2008 Presidential Election."

The Christian Defense Coalition did not produce that piece of material. I have never read it. We did not endorse it at our news conference.

The literature was handed out after the news conference by a person who attended the news conference. I called him up to find out what had happened, and he told me he had given the material out and that the group who produced the material was on the back of the literature. It was not the Christian Defense Coalition.

@dl: As I understand the libertarians, they are for personal freedom, choice and responsibility. It sounds pretty Jesus like to me. Jesus said (something like) "give unto Caesar that which is Caesars and give unto the lord that which is the lords". Sounds like separation of church and state to me.

(dl, if I've completely missed the point of libertarians, ok. I can't say I've spent much time keeping up on them).

@carolyn: The Pope has come out and told catholics to vote against abortion. That's coming from the top. No Trinity Church or childish assumptions needed.

I'd just like to say that I agree wholeheartedly with Karela's comment about Christ's example being simple. I'm against abortion, but I'm like Obama as well as many other Christians when I stand up for Roe vs. Wade and it's protection of individualism. We cannot force our beliefs onto anyone. And, even though it's really sad to kill what I believe is "life", I'd rather something be done by a doctor than by a desperate woman who'd have an abortion with or without the legality. I also think that the Christian defense should spend their money on abstinence campaigns and/or condoms rather than really illogical ads that have an air of racism.

Also, to anyone who's still on that dumb Wright thing -- get off it! I can't believe that you've all forgotten who many other religious leaders have said equally (if not more so) stupid remarks...Jerry Falwell, Billy Graham, Franklin Graham, and I'm sure more:

We're all human and we all say dumb things. Even McCain and his pretzel policy points are dumb. So, start focusing on real issues at hand -- not stuff we've already been forgiven for.

I'm Christian, family is Catholic, and I'm voting for Obama for lots of reasons and issues at hand.

==You can't be a Christian and vote to allow babies in botched abortions who survive to sit there and die with no medical intervention.==

That legislation wasn't based on any actual science. It was voted down, not just by Obama, but by a majority in the Senate, because it was baseless posturing by people more keen to make a political point than to present a bill backed by actual science. Abortions don't result in live births, no matter how premature. You've been misinformed.

jP over 3000 people lost their lives in a matter of a few hours thanks to the middle east terrorist on 9/11.

Over 20,000 died in one day on d-day

2000 died on pearl harbor day.

what is your point for You keeping a body count

Oh may, are the "pro-birthers" at it again? Every four years like clock work. What exactly do they do between election years? Oh that's right, they wait for the war on Christmas and the next SpongeBob homosexuality movie.

yawn.....

I am Catholic, but I know that over 4,000 people lost their lives in Bush's war. American christians supported Bush in the last two elections. I am more concerned about the quality of live for those who are already born. Also, there are so many females giving birth to babys without being married now, it's almost a non-issue. The christrian people need to speak to the people who are getting these abortions. I don't like the idea of same sex marriage, but I believe that is strictly a religious conviction not a civil one. Gay people pay taxes too and have constitutional rights. I don't like or agree with many things that people do, but if the US constitution gives them that right, so be it.

I think people that are posting things about how bad the AD is are probably un-godly people that think Humans are really animals.

Its the same religious right that supports the death penalty, the war in Iraq (and seemingly any war in general).
They would have more credibility if they weren't so hypocritical. Modern day pharisees.

Yes--well if the Religious Right wants to get upset they should look at what two white women did for Obama with their freedom of sexuality and choice: '2 Girls 1 Obama'--I can't decide whether to laugh or cry!!!

When will CHRISTIANS demand these obviously NON-CHRISTIANS not take the name of CHRISTIANS in vain?

CHRISTIANS who DO NOT SPEAK OUT are ENABLERS and allow their good reputations dragged thru the dirt.

Where's the RIGHTEOUS ANGER?

Where's your voice?

Use it or lose it.

It is the right of the Catholic church to have a position on abortion and to tell its parishioners that they should vote that way. And frankly, this argument is actually a good one; viewed as a fundamental human right, as many intelligent people view it, abortion could be considered sufficient to justify single-issue voting, as did slavery.

Personally, I am anti-abortion but vote pro-choice, and I certainly will vote for Obama unless something really weird happens between now and the election. (Can't imagine what that could be, because I can't imagine ever voting for McCain at this point.) But this particular conservative Christian group has a principled stand and a credible argument for its position on this matter.

And we wonder why an increasing number of people don't attend services anymore. This speaks thousands. "let he who has no sin throw the first rock" Go on CDC throw it! Shame Shame Shame on you!

Is it the same religious right who support gambling and corporate control? Is it the same religious right who support tax cuts for the wealthy and gun rights? How many lives does guns take away every day? I bet it will be much much more than the choice every women has the right to.

Please READ the pamphlet before spouting off your uninformed opinions. The "racist, hateful" comments about slavery is neither! It basically sets up a parallel between 'A person who opposes slavery can't morally support a slave owner' and 'A person who opposes abortion can't morally support a woman who chooses an abortion'.

Not for me to judge, but I would say this is not the way of a true Christian. Shame, shame... guess Church is more of a social gathering for them.

At the end of the day, it's still a fact that the numbers of deaths by abortion world-wide (combined surgical and medical abortions) is now in the billions, with no let-up in sight. Each fetus was living. Each was human. And a being, not an abstract.

The religious right is so twisted with hatred and bigotry that they don't even see this as wrong. As someone who grew up in a deep southern state, I can tell you that the evangelical, fundamentalist Christian right doesn't have a clue what Christianity is all about. They are by and large uneducated and ignorant, and they would do anything to keep a black man out of office.

i want to know what does slavery has to do with abortion? no one owns anyone. these smears are ugly and have no place in this arena obama has my vote a woman has a right to her body. it is her choice either way. perfect example look at those 17 teens in mass if they were educated on prevention and getting an education and making a life for themselves instead being strapped down with a baby for the rest of their life that is slavery unwarrented for at least 18 years in the lowest form. the catholic church needs to address these issues, instead of putting fear about electing a black man ( who is just a man in my eyes) who will do good for this country instead of mccain who will take us to wwlll

I'm a Catholic. I don't have to tell people I have Christian values. I live them everyday of my life. I will vote for Barack Obama.

To quote the late, great George Carlin regarding so-called pro-lifers: "They aren't pro-life; they're anti-women!"

Seriously people abortion is completely legal in Italy, the most Catholic country in the world. It's not even seen as a viable political stance. In a vote to ban abortion Italian (who are mostly Catholic) voted to keep abortions legal by more than 80%. People be crazy here in America sometimes.

"no faithful Catholic would vote for a candidate who, although 'personally opposed to slavery,' supported 'a white man's right to choose' to own slaves."

The logic of this is pretzel - dipped in mud - BAD analogy on many levels. Anyone heard of the Missouri Compromise?

FYI - Abe Lincoln was one of those that "personally opposed slavery" but was not opposed to it in states where it already existed. Before the American Civil War and even on the war's early stages Lincoln said that the Constitution prohibited the federal government from abolishing slavery in states where it already existed. His position and the position of the Republican Party in 1860 was that slavery should not be allowed to expand into any more territories, and thus all future states admitted to the Union would be free states.

Of course he "Flipped Flopped" later but thats another story

the inconsistencies on the right are staggering. how can you be pro-life and support the death penalty??? this is an impossible paradox.

the reason that people who don't believe in abortion personally still support a woman's right to choose is simple, and isn't inconsistent at all. if abortions are illegal, then women will die getting them. it is a medical procedure and needs to be kept SAFE and LEGAL. period.

The ad is true they are running. Obama wants tax payers to pay for abortions and approves of most types of abortins. Obama also approves of NOT giving health care to a baby born live to a failed abortion.

If it were not true then SUE them.

I am gasping at the pump and my grandson is in Iraq.

I CANNOT AFFORD TO BE A SINGLE ISSUE VOTER.

Obama 'O8

I WAS an angry Hillary supporter.

But within two or so weeks after the end of the Dem. Primaries, I found it increasingly embarassing to sustain my McCain Shift.

These ads don't help. I'll vote for the better of two tepid choices.

This Catholic woman will be voting for Barack Obama, as will many of my Catholic family members, friends and co-workers. Millions of us are NOT fools. We will not be duped.

Rogo wrote:

So if life begins at conception, does that mean that someone who is 20 1/2 years old can get a drink at a bar?

This is too funny!!

Whether or not being a single-issue voter is okay is something that has nothing to do with slavery. There are plenty of other examples of issues so important to voters that they trump all other issues.

Why did the authors of this flyer choose slavery, of all things, to make their point?

The choice is not innocent. Nor are the authors innocent of the historical and cultural subtext of the images and comparisons they choose to employ.

Which is worse: voluntary abortion or voluntary contraception? Abortion is worse. If the Catholic Church, the Evangelicals, and Republicans opposed to abortion wanted to reduce it, they would launch a huge campaign promoting birth control ande distributing free pills and condoms. But they don't want to end abortion. They want the impossible. They want teenagers and mothers with seven kids to stop having sex or to have nwanted babies as pnishment for their sins. Doesn't work does it? One definition of insanity is to keep doing the same things while expecting a better outcome. Look at the birthrates in Europe! Not enough to maintain the present poplation. Look at the abortion rates -- much lower than e U.S. If you hate fetuses dying in agony, then recognize that unmated ova and sperm die without a whimper (but then they aren't really alive are they? So who gives a damn? Why should proportionately more American fetuses die in agony, while proportionately fewer European fetuses are aborted? Check this conundrum out with your friendly neighborhood bishop or monsignor and report back, but then they are too busy defending the Church against charges of sheltering pedophine priests (not the altar boys against pedophilile priests to spend any time actually reducing the number of abortions in their dioceses.

McCain now ranks as the #1 most absent senator of the 110th Congress, having missed 61.8 percent of the votes. He even beats Sen. Tim Johnson (D-SD), who took several months off while recovering from a brain hemorrhage

I don't understand what the fuss is all about. Their point was that it is ok to be a single issue voter. They are saying that as someone who disapproves of slavery, it is ok for you not to vote for someone who supports the right to slavery even if the candidate otherwise doesn't own slaves. This is a perfectly legitimate analogy.

This Catholic will be voting for Obama.

I feel like if you don't want an abortion, you shouldn't have one. Roe v. Wade isn't going to make you have an abortion. It gives you the right to choose not to have an abortion as much as it gives you the right to have one.

Abortion is not going to go away whether you make it illegal, or not.

So if life begins at conception, does that mean that someone who is 20 1/2 years old can get a drink at a bar?

If anything this helps Obama's cause, by confirming how bigoted and hateful the religious right really is. This will get Obama more votes, not less.

To "Christian" and others who assert that it is somehow not racist to equate opposing slavery with opposing abortion...

The comparison explicitly puts black people--fully grown adults, capable of functioning on their own--on the same footing as fetuses--which truly are helpless.

Considering that one of the most popular arguments put forth in support of slavery was that black people were too simple-minded, helpless, and childlike to effectively care for themselves, I would say that the comparison is, indeed, racist.

Even if the person making the comparison didn't intend it that way, the very fact of that person's ignorance of how the comparison might be received by people of color, and his/her ignorance about the history of the struggle against slavery, is, in itself, racist.

Jesus was a simple man. He came to teach us about love. He advocated feeding the hungry and clothing the naked. He spoke with Love in His heart and he never, ever attempted to Force other people to do anything. He would not be in favor of killing a million Iraqi men, women and children and then voting to kill even more. He would not be part of driving two and a half million Iraqi people from their homes. He may not have been in favor of abortion, but He would never have attempted to Force others to do what he said. Jesus never operated from Force or from fear. He always operated from Love. If He were here in a body today, He would not have been a part of an ad like this one. He would be doing what He always did. He would be feeding the hungry, clothing the naked, praying for the broken hearted and Loving all people equally. We could now be living in Heaven on earth if we all lived our lives the way Jesus did. Aren't we tired even yet of hatred and fear and anger?

PRO-LIFE ARE STUP*DILY PRO-DEATH PENALTY...VERY CHRISTIAN INDEED!

I think it should be pointed out that this literature was not written during this presidential cycle. I saw the same quote over 20 years ago...it's a very common tactic in anti-abortion communication: a historical comparison of a fetus to a black person, who at one time in this country's past, was not granted the same basic rights to life liberty and property as white males. It's just that with a black man actually running in the race, this reference seems racist. Look closer: it's really not.

Rezko, Pfleger, Wright, Ayers.

They do matter.

They speak to judgment, or in Obama's case, the lack of judgment. He wrapped himself in these miscreants. Now he can't get far enough away from them.

Obama said repeatedly that he did not hear the hateful vitriole from Wright, but in his audio book Obama comes right out and says that he did hear it.

Obama is an out and out liar.

And he is counting heavily on your ignorance.

You people need to get over Rev. Wright and Father Pflager. Why keep using that as your transparent excuse to hate Obama? Pflager and Wright are no more anti-American than you are and no less patriotic. Stop being zombies led by pundits who feed your pea brains with nonsense. Rezko, Ayers.....please! You all need to get a life and stop clinging to news for ratings, it makes all of you sound racist, unpatriotic and anti-American. Oh, and BITTER!

Rodney...message received and yes, the Iraqi people and the Iranians and all the other innocent people caught between a rock and a hard spot when Governments recklessly engage in war when diplomacy is an option. I'm not a fan of Olmert if that is where you are going.

The smell of flopsweat is filling the room as they beocme more desperate and uglier in their attacks.

Logically, it seems terribly hypocritical to be "Pro-Life" and support the war at the same time. How can conservatives explain that one?

heidi--dont forget the innocent iraq people---

kat...Why would catholics be embarrassed by this?

I can't speak nor would I dare speak for G-d but I can imagine being a parent as I am...that this must be one of his least accomplishments. Evil is alive and well. Not that I agree with abortion but where do these people stand on the children of parents getting killed for oil?

repubs are in a panic and will try anything to get your vote-- ikeep wondering what is next---perhaps cross burning---anything is possible --and dont blame the church for what mortals have done--punish them as we need the church.

x marks the spot...You must go to church at Trinity. Obama's church. That's where they discuss politics. I have never been to a church that politics were ever discussed.

Hard to imagine why any group would use this imagery to attack Obama. Talk about insensitive. Like invoking the holocaust in oppo to Lieberman in 2000 or something. Does this backfire?

Dooms,

Russia was ruled by thugs who abused their power and kept all the wealth for themselves, deprived their people to the point where they had no choice but to go along. (Sounds alot like the current administration, ya think?) Same goes for Cuba. Are you saying the United States is going to deteriorate to that point?

This is typical of the so-called "Christian" Rightists. They support the right to life from conception to birth. Anything else including the truth is purely situational.

Rick,

How can Obama have a GOD complex? Dooms is convinced he's the Antichrist or something.

Topher you just looking at spikes in a capitalist economy. Spikes are normal in a capitalist economy. Complete failures of modern govt's that went libral in recent history. Ever hear of RUSSIA for one big example.

Dooms,

What recent history? The most recent recessions and spikes in unemployment. I can think of were under Reagan and the pending official recession that W. has caused. Were they liberal govt's?

Where are some facts to back your statements up?

dooms

what recent history?

you mean the empires that take over other countries? and then fall apart after they lose perspective?

or do you mean the governments that are driven by religion...oh like...

oh this is too fun

didn't a bunch of Clintons big donors donate money to McCain

Does Obama have a "God Complex"?

dl you make it sound like a good thing that atheist are gaining ground. Recent history has shown Liberal GOVT'S are doomed to failure and massive unemployment.

Let alone what the bible warns of the fate of country's that practice what Liberals want to allow.

Obama has no business pushing any faith issue.
Reverend Wright and Father Pflager were enough for me and my community.
They are racist and anti Americans.
These men were Obama's mentors and friends.
How dare Obama consider asking for any evangelical to stand with him.
He needs to be talking about his relationship with Wrightm, plager, Farrakhan, Rezko and Ayers before he goes any further.
The Republicans didn't forget these guys.
What's wrong with Democrats.
Is this only about race?

Dooms,

Most of America is grossly undereducated. Just stupid enough to believe everything they're read and everything they're told.

The conservatives don't even know what the word conservative means anymore. Last I checked, the Bush administration is spending liberally for our two wars and giving big business very liberal tax breaks. Conservatives just want to limit every social issue that makes them uncomfortable. The whole "if I don't like it no one else should be allowed to do it either" argument is just an exercise in controlling people.

dooms

you're wrong

most of America is not VERY conservative...go look at the numbers...they have changed much ...
especially in the last 4 years.

The number of people that call themselves liberal has doubled...and the number that says they are open to liberal views...tripled.

The country is like it was with abolition and women's rights and it's own initial inception and creation of it's constitution moving forward and more "liberal"...

almost every great American and movement in our history was termed in one way or another "liberal"

8 years ago we tried to swing back...look what it got us.

topper it is amazing that we embargo cuba---and china one of the worst human rights abusers in the world is a ok-----does someone think we are all that stupid.

kat most of America is very Conservative.

I'm glad the Christian Defense Coalition is paying to let it be known that Obama is pro-choice. It saves NARAL and Planned Parenthood some time and money. Maybe the Obama campaign doesn't particularly mind CDC's endorsement for McCain, given that it's clearly an extremist group which isn't taken seriously by the majority of Americans.

You can't be a Christian and vote to allow babies in botched abortions who survive to sit there and die with no medical intervention. That's what Obama did. I don't know what he is, but he's not a Christian.

dooms
we are all given free will and the ability to learn----and by now i think most know what the next step is-----so try to be civil to each other----you are only on a short visit here.====a little humor is a ok---

dl...For every one reason you have to not vote for McCain I could give you 10 reasons I would not vote for Obama. Most of them are quite frightening.
What makes you think Obama will be such a good President. Try to ask yourself that. A President that is willing without preconditions to talk to terrorists.

Dooms,

that's great. you're entitled to your opinion just like I'm entitled to mine. But my logic tells me that fiction doesn't come true.

we have started to discuss war---i feel the pain when one of ours gets killed-----i also feel the same for the innocent--a group of which i do not see any numbers of-----can anyone give me a count----see what i mean

dl the bible clearly states that the world belongs to the devil. He was cast down and is now roaming to a forth over the land.

When Jesus was taken captive. One of disciples cut off the ear of a roman solider. He told the disciple not to resist them. Jesus said he could call down a legion of angels to save him.

exactly

I am fully pro-choice and support Obama, but as a news organization you shouldn't be censoring this organization's materials. A picture of an aborted fetus is hard to look at, but so are pictures of dead soldiers in Iraq. People need to see the truth in order to make informed decisions. Make both versions available and include a warning, but don't make that judgment for people.

RODNEY the reason we know right from wrong is simple. GOD made it that way. Animals no matter how smart do not and never will have the knowledge of RIGHT and WRONG.

we are all born wiyh an inherint knowledge of right and wrong--and most of you show it---in one way or another---is that not what it is all about----yes you all know what is right and what is wrong.you have a free will use it accordingly.

We can disagree with Obama or McCain but when interest groups that supports a particular candidate does things like the CDC has done--then that crosses the line.