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Rick Warren Takes On His Critics: "I'm a Big Target"
August 15, 2008 8:03 AM
In another part of our interview with best-selling author and pastor Rick Warren, I asked him about some of the controversies surrounding his church.
I asked him, for instance, about the criticism that he offers a sort of glib, new age Christianity. Rev. Bob DeWaay, author of a book criticizing Warren’s approach, says “the Bible’s theme is about redemption and atonement, not finding meaning and solving problems.” How does he respond to the charge that he offers a shallow 40-day approach to Christianity?
"I flatly deny it," Warren says. "The average message I teach on a weekend contains fourteen passages of scripture. I am a multi-generation pastor which many of these critics don't. I am a Bible scholar. I've had six years of Greek and Hebrew. They don’t know what they’re talking about. And what happens is you often get pigeon-holed because if a church is large then people tend to think it’s shallow and that’s not true. All large churches are not alike. All mega-churches are not alike."
“The truth is there’s a lot of people who don’t know what’s going on and they read second- and third- and fourth-hand reports which are incorrect,” Warren says. “There have been things written for instance, ‘Oh Rick Warren, the Hawaiian-shirted pastor.’ I haven’t worn a Hawaiian shirt in two years but that’s still being reported around the nation.”
Continued Warren, “there are all kinds of caricatures. I’m criticized by people who are either ignorant or they’re jealous. And the fact is were seeing God make a difference in individual lives, thousands and thousands of lives. I started this church with one person, my wife. Today there over a 100,000 names on our church roll. It’s the size of a city. We’re a really big target. And when you get invited to do an interview like this of course that creates all kinds of people who want to criticize you and when you’re trying to promote the common good and when you’re trying to promote civility there are a lot of people who have a stake in being uncivil. They make their living polarizing and so if I were simply just the left than the right would criticize me. And if I were just the right than the left would criticize me but I’m trying to stake out a common middle ground here so I get it from both sides and that’s the price of impact.”
There have also been reports of other churches trying to follow Warren’s example and create “Purpose Driven” and Saddleback-esque churches but losing parishioners.
“I would like to disavow a lot of the things that are done in the name of ‘Purpose Driven’ or done in the name of Saddleback, because I’m not responsible for everybody else’s church,” Warren said. “And some guys are just poor leaders. And they do things and say “we’re doing it like Saddleback,” but really, I would disavow what they’re doing”
That said, Warren continued, “for every example of negativity I could give you a hundred positivity. We’ve trained now almost 500,000 church leaders around the world in 162 countries. I’ve been training leaders for twenty-eight years, business leaders, government leaders, church leaders. In a couple weeks I’m going to the nation of Kenya where I’ve been invited to give an all day seminar on leadership to the entire parliament,…we just finished a thirty day tour of Latin America.”
“I’m a big target,” Warren said, “It doesn’t bother me. It’s like…during the Civil War the guy who wore the Union blue top and the Confederate blue bottom and he got shot at from both sides. That’s just part of trying to be a bridge builder, a moderator, a voice of civility. Our civilization is becoming increasingly uncivil. We’re becoming ruder. Were not getting nicer to each other were getting ruder. And some how we have to figure out as the world becomes more pluralistic -- to quote that great theologian Rodney King, ‘Can’t we all just get along?’ We don’t have to agree. We don’t have to compromise our beliefs. We don’t have to water down our convictions but we do have to be civil. And why do I believe that? Because Jesus said love your neighbor as yourself, in fact he said love your enemies. So I am commanded to love people that I disagree with.”
“It’s not easy to be criticized,” I said to him.
“Nobody likes to be criticized,” Warren said.
“And it seems like it might bother you a little bit,” I said. “You are a huge success and your good works are undeniable and I’m not trying to take away from that. But I sense in this interview that these people get under your skin a little bit.”
Said Warren, “people get under my skin for about five seconds. I consider both praise and criticism, it’s kind of like chewing gum. You chew on it for a little while but you don’t swallow because ultimately I’m living for Jesus Christ. That’s my goal. And my philosophy when criticism comes at me, if it’s true: listen and learn from it. If it’s untrue ignore it and forget it.”
“And ultimately realize God is the judge of your life,” Warren concluded. “Jesus said ‘Beware when all men speak well of you’ and I would point out that Jesus was not criticized by the world he was criticized by the religious leaders and 27:39 the criticism I get is far greater from people who have staked out a very narrow position and want me to kowtow to that position rather than the poor, the sick, the needy, the helpless -- the people Jesus really cared about.”
- jpt
August 15, 2008 | Permalink | Share | User Comments (28)
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Who is Rick Warren and who cares?
Posted by: Vote Hillary | Aug 15, 2008 9:46:21 AM
actually, m. summer, it is true. he and cindy met in 1979 and fell in love, by his own admission in his 2002 book. he did not petition for divorce until 1980. he's also been known to have extra- marital affairs during his time in jacksonville, forida after he returned home from vietnam, admitting that his marriage to carol was disintegrating.
look it up.
and btw, i even heard mr. tapper having this very discussion on novaM radio the other day. he knows it to be true as well.
Posted by: cathcatz | Aug 15, 2008 9:30:19 AM
I think that it is really sick that Rick Warren seeks to promote his ministry by advocating caring for those with HIV on the one hand, and condemning more people to suffer it by promoting the substitution of 'abstinence only' programs instead of condom use.
Kay Warren says "this is not a political issue, it’s a moral one". WRONG - this is a public health issue, and government needs to address it.
Just look at Uganda. The evangelicals have condemned thousands to death by stopping what had been a hugely successful AIDS prevention program and instituting a faith based approach instead.
I think that it is good that the Warrens want to 'reduce the stigma attached to HIV' but that isnt enough. I applaud their efforts to help people who already have HIV/AIDS, but unless they have an interest in making the existence of a large number of infected people permanent, they need to change THEIR behavior.
Posted by: Mike | Aug 15, 2008 9:15:52 AM
Wish Jake would ask Warren what he thought Of Obama's church and spriritual asvisor--Rev Wright.
Oh and Obama's moral compass--Father Pfleger. Does he feel the love coming from these men?
Posted by: riley | Aug 15, 2008 8:58:16 AM
I read Rick Warren's 40 day book. I was not impressed, but he must be doing something that people like if he has a church of 100,000. I personally know of pastors who lead country churches whose membership never exceeds 100. They faithfully visit the sick, bury the dead, baptize the children, and marry the young. Their sermons are much more eloquent than the words that Warren utters, but their reward will not be realized in this life. Unfortunately, we have such a odd way of evaluating success.
Posted by: Brother Bill | Aug 15, 2008 8:56:23 AM
Yawn! Warren is a big phony. Just another human being ( nothing devine about him ) looking for answers and telling people he's found them and profiting from it. He's a salesman. No reason to listen to him.
Posted by: don | Aug 15, 2008 8:54:24 AM
cathcatz - Maybe because it's not TRUE?!?
Posted by: M. Summer | Aug 15, 2008 8:52:09 AM
jake, tsk tsk. i watched your piece on gma this morning where you interviewed rev. warren. you asked him a very pointed question about john edwards' infidelity, and then whether that kind of transgression would sway his vote. he answered that it absolutely would.
why did you not then ask if he was aware of john mccain's infidelity in his marriage to his first wife??
Posted by: cathcatz | Aug 15, 2008 8:18:53 AM
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