Live Debate Blogging by Rick Klein

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Live Debate Blogging by Rick Klein

February 21, 2008 8:00 PM

9:47 pm ET: They end with a handshake, but it may as well have been a hug. (And how did Chelsea get on stage so fast?)

If all you're doing as a voter is making a judgment based on this debate, it's easy to come away supporting Clinton. But that's not how the election works -- the fact is Sen. Clinton was looking for ways to recast the debate tonight, and we didn't get that. A few new lines on a few old arguments do not result in any changed dynamics, not by my judgment. If you're an Obama fan, you're generally pleased with the night.

That's it for tonight -- check back tomorrow, as always, for a full analysis and look ahead in The Note.

9:41 pm ET: ABC's Sunlen Miller: Obama does not mention his drug use as a teenager in the last question…but scratches the surface "rocky periods during my youth – made mistake and was off course."

Good sentiment to close with for Clinton: "Well I think everyone here knows I've lived through some crises."

9:36 pm ET: Sort of a passive response from Clinton on superdelegates: "These are the rules that are followed, and this will sort itself out." Bottom line is Obama has a stronger argument -- and surely one that's more appealing to voters.

9:32 pm ET: The pork question -- good general-election preview. Either Democrat is going to be on the defensive on this against Sen. McCain.

And Obama glossed over his record -- he released his earmarks for 2007, but not the other two years he's been in the Senate.

9:28 pm ET: ABC's Sunlen Miller: "Obama first to mention McCain - and make the electiability argument."

9:21 pm: As they retreat to their corners -- does anyone feel like Sen. Clinton did Sen. Obama significant damage tonight -- enough, say, to slow his rise? I'm not sure I see that anywhere tonight.

9:14 pm ET: Is Obama slamming the Massachusetts healthcare plan? The one Ted Kennedy so heartily embraced?

9:12 pm ET: That's two John Edwards mentions from Clinton...

9:11 pm ET: The Clinton campaign passes this around:

Tonight, Sen. Obama said: “In Youngstown, Ohio, I talked to workers who have seen their plants shipped overseas due to consequences of poor deals it's like NAFTA that have literally seen equipment unbolted from the floors of factories and shipped to China.” [CNN Univision Debate, 2/21/08]

John Kerry in 2004: “What does it mean in America today when Dave McCune, a steel worker I met in Canton, Ohio, saw his job sent overseas and the equipment in his factory literally unbolted, crated up, and shipped thousands of miles away along with that job?” [Kerry Remarks, Democratic Convention, 7/29/04 <http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/5552784/> ]

9:06 pm ET: At the break here -- finally some engagement. But we haven't heard a single new argument, from either candidate, all night. The Xerox line was about the only memborable new line from either candidate. But it's still not going to be a game-changer of an issue, the shock that Obama would borrow some phrases from one of his national campaign co-chairmen.

9:05 pm ET: And -- with few big endorsements left out there -- ABC's Sunlen Miller picks up on the fact that Clinton is the first to mention John Edwards.

9 pm ET: "Change you can Xerox," -- Clinton says. WOW. Now we're into the meat... I'm still not convinced that this is an issue that will vault Clinton back into this game, but it's an opening, and she's going for it. These last 10 minutes have had just about all of the zingers of the night.

8:58 pm ET: Big laughter and applause for Obama as he parries the plagiarism charge. "This is when we start getting into the silly season in politics," Obama says -- a good counter.

8:55 pm ET: Obama's counter: "People understand that it is not just a matter of putting forward policy positions." (Love Clinton's smile when Obama said she's suggesting his supporters are "delusional.")

8:52 pm ET: Clinton: "Our next president needs to be a lot less hat, and a lot more cattle." But she makes clear she's talking about President Bush, not Obama. This is her contrast: "I do offer solutions -- that's what I believe in, and what I've done." Then comes the dig: that MSNBC clip where an Obama surrogate couldn't name an Obama accomplishment. "Words are important, and words matter, but actions speak louder than words." So far - quote of the night.

ABC's Eloise Harper points out that it should be Clinton thanking John King for the opening.

8:51 pm ET: THANK YOU, John King, for calling them out on what they say on the stump vs. what they have the nerve to say on debate stages.

8:46 pm ET: Man, this is docile, low-key stuff for a debate with stakes this high...

8:44 pm ET: Clinton calls for English to be "our common, unifying language." Carefully chosen words for her Latino supporters. And ABC's Eloise Harper asks -- what is keeping Clinton from taking her own advice in learning another language?

8:41 pm ET: Forty minutes in -- a whole lot of agreeing going on tonight. Clearly, at this point, the Clinton gameplan of conpetence and confidence has not changed. Perhaps she's waiting for the right question to unfurl the right answer. But so far, both candidates are running against the Bush administration.

8:37 pm ET: "There is a smart way to protect our borders, and there is a dumb way to protect our borders," Clinton says. A decent Texas-themed line punctuating a debate that's not breaking much new ground.

8:34 pm ET: Sunlen Miller: "Obama wont admit that he agrees with what Clinton says on immigration. . . he says instead he'll add to it."

And Ray -- yes, the Univision moderator does have an Anderson Cooper quality to him.

8:31 pm ET: ABC's Sunlen Miller notices Clinton using the word "hoodwink" -- something Obama says all the time... Politicians don't borrow words from each other, do they?

8:28 pm ET: Clinton me-toos Obama on the economy, but also brings urgency and immediacy into her answer -- these moratoriums and interest-rate freezes. And she's bringing that Obama quality -- hope.

8:25 pm ET: Asked about differences on the economy, Obama covers the entire map without naming any differences. It's all about how they're going to get it done, he says. There was a time that Sen. Clinton would have given an answer like that.

8:22 pm ET: As the exchange over meeting with foreign leaders ended, ABC's Eloise Harper notices: "Big smile from Clinton after that zing. She looked very pleased."

8:16 pm ET: First distinction of the night was the first big distinction of the campaign -- meeting with the president of Cuba. But I'm not sure I understand how Obama can say he's not for preconditions before meeting with Raul Castro but is for preparation that includes preconditions like releasing political prisoners.

8:14 pm ET: I'm struck initially by Clinton's measured tone. No sense of panic in her voice. She sounds calm, in charge, deliberate.

8:12 pm ET: You can hear the cold in Obama's voice. And his opening statement has a quick reference to his opposition to the war. And this: "What's lacking right now is not good ideas." Also -- this applause is annoying. I know it's hard to contain these Texans' enthusiasm, but it feels more rally-ish and less debate-ish with the audience participation.

8:08 pm ET: "I offer a lifetime of experience and proven results," Clinton says. In for a dime...

8:06 pm ET: Now it's nearly 36 years of Clinton experience -- and about one full year of that message. And she lays claim to Texas roots approximately immediately -- with a Barbara Jordan reference, and an Ann Richards one to boot. That's some tasty BBQ for veteran Texas Democrats, who are enjoying the love tonight.

7:58 pm ET: And in case you need a reminder of the stakes -- the new ABC/Washington Post poll shows just how close this race is in Ohio and Texas. This is troubling news for Sen. Clinton -- her must-wins. But she still has an edge...

7:52 pm ET: Also -- this debate will get lots of coverage, sure. But who on that stage do you think is happy that all of the political oxygen today was consumed by a (maybe) sex scandal on the Republican side?

7:45 pm ET: So, 15 minutes away -- expectations? I should quit that part of the gig since I've been off so wildly before virtually all of these debates. BUT -- pressure is always on the candidate with the most at stake, and that, of course, is Hillary Clinton. I don't, though, think she'll come out on the all-out attack -- my guess would be tries to bait Barack Obama into a spat. Then she can sit back and see how he handles it.

If that doesn't work -- well, anything goes.

Hi everyone, Rick Klein from ABC's The Note. I'll be live-blogging during tonight's Democratic debate in Austin, Texas -- watch on CNN, and follow along with running commentary here, starting at 8 pm ET.

February 21, 2008 in Tancredo, Tom | Permalink | User Comments (261)

User Comments

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I did not realize Canada was still canadian. LOL

Hey how about that McCain.

I did not have lobbyist relations with that woman. Sounds familiar?

Posted by: PollCat | Feb 21, 2008 6:25:35 PM

I don't know about you but I'm pumped. We're gonna change stuff and I hope we change stuff. I have no idea what we're gonna change or even what stuff.

Posted by: Wil | Feb 21, 2008 6:32:28 PM

Wil, I think you need to look at Obama's website. It seems to be the direction that people are pointed to. Kind of like the North Star.

Posted by: jeff | Feb 21, 2008 6:38:50 PM

Thanks pollcat, but if anyone down there thinks gas prices are high now, give it another year. Don't mean to comment on your domestic election, but as your neighbor I ask you all to think of the mess that the Arab states will be soon facing. That's not going to be pretty over there and it will come back and hit you all in your pocket books big time. I'm not asking anyone to change their vote or anything, but I am asking you all to think this thing through very carefully.

Posted by: Canada | Feb 21, 2008 6:39:55 PM

Exactly, Canada, I think Obama, Hillary, McCain must answer this question because if we say we want change and if energy prices hit us in the pocketbook then all the changes we hope for can never be made.

Posted by: Wil | Feb 21, 2008 6:48:21 PM

When Obama made such a big deal about blowing his nose earlier, is he trying to let us know that we shouldn't expect too much, because, poor baby, he's got a cold. Talk about lowering expectations. The smart thing if he indeed has a cold would have been to cut back on his schedule. No more free pass for you. You want to be the frontrunner, then stand up for the scrutiny it brings.

Posted by: mass voter | Feb 21, 2008 7:04:56 PM

Mmmmmm, that Kool-Aid is some good stuff. And it sure costs less than a Clinton campaign consultant.

Posted by: Paul | Feb 21, 2008 7:26:13 PM

My hope is that Senator Clinton doesn't make an all-out effort to be critical of her opponent, Senator Obama, in tonight's debate. One of them will go on to win the number of delegates needed to secure the nomination, and the party will have to unite behind whomever that is if we're to turn this country around. McCain has already figured out who his opposition is going to be, and, while I'm not that much of McCain fan, I do not think the man is stupid. Democrats, all of us, must begin thinking forward to November.

Posted by: Opa | Feb 21, 2008 7:27:20 PM

The Democratic party is now divided beyond repair for this election year. It is highly probable that Obama is going to get the Democratic nomination, and Hillary supporters (of which I am one) will vote for McCain in the general election as the lesser of the two evils.

I was much better off after Bill Clinton's administration than when he took office, because he understood fiscal responsibility and knew how to balance the budget, which in turn stimulated the economy and the stock markets. His support of technology and the Internet played a big part in that as well. I hated his immoral antics in office, but he knew how to create a thriving economy. My basis for voting for Hillary is that she learned how to manage the economy first hand. While taxes did increase during the Clinton administration, my salary doubled and my investments tripled, so I did not care.

Obama has no experience on how to manage a budget. He is promising everything to everyone. He is a true "tax and spend" liberal with no fiscal knowledge or experience on how to improve the economy. I have researched his policies, and I know that based on his tax and spend agenda that my company will struggle and put my job at risk, my investments will not grow, and my taxes will increase. I cannot put my family at risk based on this man's hollow rhetoric and lack of experience. I know that if I vote for McCain, at least he won't increase my taxes unnecessarily.

Believe me, I am not alone here. There are hundreds of thousands of Hillary supporters that will defect with me. I am saddened that our party is now driven by emotion instead of logic. I guess that I'll just hope for better in another 8 years.

Posted by: Michael Hicks | Feb 21, 2008 7:29:27 PM

The idea that Obama is not being specific is now outdated. People who are still saying this may have had a point about a month ago, but they have clearly not been keeping up with Obama's speeches. He's now given detailed speeches regarding a wide range of policy proposals, which, by the way, are virtually the same as Clinton's (politicians share policy advisors). If you want detail Obama, it's now available. No more excuses. He's a balanced candidate on all counts.

Posted by: Marcus Watson | Feb 21, 2008 7:29:42 PM

and McCain and Clinton have given specifics on what???? Oh, nothing! soundbite city! "In it to win it!" and "Universal Healthcare!" Obama wrote a book, yep specifics in it, has a blue print and positions all over his website..yep...OH and does offer specifics in speeches, but that makes for boring TV. His platform is same as Clinton and Democratic Party....he just says it better... do your homework folks

Posted by: some guy in georgia | Feb 21, 2008 7:36:20 PM

I think Obama is caught up in a political party that does not represent all of his values. I think that's why he dodges certain votes. I think he is afraid to speak openly about his values because he is afraid he won't get elected. The Democrats want Obama to bring them 'change'. Oh, he'll bring them 'change' alright, but I don't think it will be the 'change' they expect. I think he will change them. He will change the Democratic party from whatever they were becoming.

Posted by: the old man | Feb 21, 2008 7:38:48 PM

and should day 1 sound like..."YES - its all mine at last! 100 Years of War!" or "YES - I will avenge my husband! Watch out right wingers, its my way or the highway!"

OR "YES WE CAN!"

Posted by: another guy in ga | Feb 21, 2008 7:41:55 PM

I have a problem that I haven't seen mentioned before in one of these blogs:

I'm a Republican who is in love with Michelle Obama.

I was a Giuliani voter in Florida; what to do now? I'd love to see Michelle in the White House, that is, I'd love to see a lot of her in the future. On the other hand, I would have preferred to see Giuliani run the country's economics as he ran New York City (and I'm afraid John McCain REALLY doesn't understand what today's complex economics is about).

I'm a bit... desperate. And foolish, no doubt.

Posted by: Chuck | Feb 21, 2008 7:45:43 PM

Rick - Good to be back. I don't mind making expectation guesses because I have nothing to lose. I think Clinton will have to tweak Obama. As per usual, about the third response or so will include a provocative reference, perhaps to the "plagiarism" and/or a swipe at Patrick for not bringing about change in MA. I think it will almost certainly be the "Words"/Solutions angle. Hopefully, Obama will keep his cool and force her to jab harder for a reaction. They both have arrows in their quiver and now no Edwards to intervene as a grown-up. Clinton really needs to change the narrative here, polls are slipping in her firewall, superd's are defecting (only from her camp), 0-11 the last contests, demos slipping away, Big Labor endorsements going against her. If Bill has coached her, she'll definitely pick a fight tonight. Try to knock Obama off-topic and pummel him with facts, 10point plans and innuendos.

Posted by: Kevin | Feb 21, 2008 8:00:04 PM

Hillary = Romney

Posted by: The Commander Guy | Feb 21, 2008 8:00:45 PM

Attention Democrats!!!

If you don't realize that the presidential election is taking place right now, then something is wrong with you. It is between Clinton the Democrat and Obama the Republican.

Posted by: Scott | Feb 21, 2008 8:05:57 PM

joy Galbraith
you should ask those qustions to Bush and hillary.

Posted by: guevera | Feb 21, 2008 8:09:21 PM

simply vote for your true love! Ron Paul could use some extra votes. No reason to vote for Obama BECAUSE you're a black voter. He's a superb politician, no doubt (the proof is in the incredible history of this campaign)
but yes, he's the most liberal of them all.

Don't forget however that Paul is a libertarian; in some respects (and also as a real worshipper of the Constitution) he's very close to Obama.

Posted by: Chuck | Feb 21, 2008 8:10:20 PM

the comparison is between
'Yes I can and Yes we can'
I, me , my self... the only person who has the expe...
It doesn't sound good. It is not appealing.
I think that is the reason...

Posted by: john | Feb 21, 2008 8:10:42 PM

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