Or doesn't matter it will be over with by then.

Obama08

I don't see anything wrong with what Bill Clinton said here. Sounds like the truth to me. A lot of people who live outside the big cities (which is where Obama is drawing most of his support) resent being tossed aside by Obama and his campaign. He can play all of the basketball he wants; if he gets elected, rural Americans, as well as anyone over 50, had better not count on him for anything.

Classic deceptive Clinton Spin, twisting someone else's words against them. The Reed professor said that Clinton campaigning in rural Oregon would not work like it did campaigning in rural PN, because the state is younger with a different demographic than PN. The Reed proffesor never said that "rural America doesn't matter" as El Clinton twists and lies about it. This is a type of devious lie that only politicians and lawyers see fit to use and abuse, and of course they know better. No ethics whatsoever! The press, as usual doesn't correct him or call him on it, because they risk getting yelled at or belittled by both Clintons. What doesn't matter now is the Clintons- except the damage that they are doing to the democratic party.

Its curious how the Obama cmap has managed to paint Clinton as a racist. He's jsut playing tough politics. He appointed more blacks to the federal bench than all previous presidents _combined_.

Debate Moderator: "Senator Clinton, do you think Senator Obama can win the National Election this fall against Senator McCain?"

Hillary Clinton: "Yes!,Yes!!,Yes!!!"

The reason they were 'booing' at the beginning wasnt againt Bill Clinton, it was against this notion that Hillary cant win rural Oregon, and they dont matter.

The article CONVIENTLY forgets to mention they were booing the ridiuclous notion -not Clinton.

Does anyone really believe that Bill and Hillary Clinton with $109 million are just average US citizens? Does anyone really believe that Bill who gets up to $400,000 per speaking engagement really thinks the small American matters?

Does anyone really NOT believe that the Clintons are driven by money, greed and power only?

This is a harbinger...of things to come... (Clyburn's accusations vs clinton.)

If the Obama camp can play the race card this deftly during the primaries, imagine what they'll do in an Obama administration. All tough questions for the president will be termed "demonizations" or "distractions".

Wake up America. Vote for the strongest candidate who can stop this fanatic goose-stepping. That would be voting for a white guy, not because you should vote against blacks or women, but because its FAR more important to America that the people can HARSHLY criticize their leaders non-stop, DAY and NIGHT. Just like its being done to W and cheney.

Its more important to maintain this freedom than to look for an affirmative action candidate. Electing either will NOT alleviate or even address the structural prejudices against both groups.

Too many people still making excuses for Obama's loss in Pennsylvania.

History Fact 1: Oregon in its infancy banned ALL blacks from settling in Oregon. Oregon became the FIRST U.S. state to exclude African Americans other than by ordinary statutory law. In a special election, Oregonians approved the proposed state constitution in which they EXCLUDED free blacks and mulattos by an 8 to 1 margin. Oregon also banned slavery in their state constitution... but that was no altruistic gesture... They just wanted NO blacks in Oregon.

History Fact 2: One black war hero came with his family over the Oregon Trail (1844) and ended up being one of Washington State's first settlers and the FIRST black settler because he was not allowed to own land in Oregon. Ironically... the man's name was George Washington Bush (1779-1863).

You are right, Nickberry! We've certainly come a long way as a more tolerant nation over the years. I'm proud to be an American- we continue to grow and accept everyone regardless of their race or gender- it is a privilege to watch this democratic primary race play out like it has.

Obama '08

Thinking,

Dream on have you seen the polls lately. Clinton is now tied with Obama nationally and is ahead of McCain in most head to head polls. Obama is now behind McCain. If you look at the all important swing states like PA Clinton is up by a significant margin while Obama is down by a significant margin especially in OH, PA, and FL.

Oh right I forgot the people of FL don't matter. Well they do if we want to elect a democrat in November.

Clinton will win IN and will come close in NC, and then Obama will get stomped on in WV, and KY. Leaving Clinton still ahead in the popular vote. If FL is then seated which looks like the DNC will address very soon. They will be very close in delegate count and she will be ahead in popular vote. I heard from someone inside the Clinton camp that she has raised an unprecedented amount of money since Tuesdays win.

GO Hillary 08

Will you send this big mouth back to where he came from,Who the hell is running for President anyway?????????
Just the facts right n the nail head.....You who switched should made to stay in that party until after the election Nit wits like you keep this thing going.You could care less for Hilly......

"Rural" Oregon is a diverse landscape and it is a demographic that differs significantly from "rural" Pennsylvania, Ohio or Arkansas where Clinton has found a base of support.

NAFTA hasn't cost us jobs; lumber mill closures began under Reagan and continued through the Clinton years; the population of our rural counties is growing; we are younger and better educated.

Obama is pursuing the American nightmare...

Get out of our proud nation!!!

The reason he won't do well in OR is that it is one of the most educated states in the country and as all polls show, that is not a group Hillary does well with. Only those who can't seem to fully understand what those 2 are about vote for her. Not my take on it but the polls don't lie.

It is too bad the media and so many "liberal" democrats were so smitten with the Obama Hysteria for so long. He is arrogant run of the mill little if any substance and a big chip on his shoulder(which is odd given his privileged life)nothing. Hillary will win but it has been a long haul.

Frankly, Obama is not QUALIfied to
be more than a legal assistant.

Bill Clinton, power-crazed prevaricator extraordinaire.

Don't listen to a word the guy says, he's selling a lie every time he opens his sleazy mouth.

I don't see anything wrong with what Bill Clinton said here. Sounds like the truth to me. A lot of people who live outside the big cities (which is where Obama is drawing most of his support) resent being tossed aside by Obama and his campaign. He can play all of the basketball he wants; if he gets elected, rural Americans, as well as anyone over 50, had better not count on him for anything.

If Florida is not reinstated as is, then the Democrats can kiss goodby to their dream of winning the next elections in November. 'Cause contrary to what the elite think, it is still a people's election and democracy must be recognized in all free states. The people of Florida have spoken so let their voices be heard.

Tor----what ignorance. Shame on you! Spinning things must be your day job.
People take a day off, it's anyone's right! They did debate over 20 times! The positions on the issues are the same! You can debate yourself to death and he still will be the better choice and the next president. How dare you scoled him on taking a day off!!

We haven't really heard much about rural issues from either campaign yet, have we? It might be interesting to have a debate focused on rural issues. That is, if Obama is willing to speak to millions of Americans will watch such a debate.

Does anyone else find it really arrogant of Obama to run for President after 1 year in the Senate? He thinks he knows what is best for our country because ????? Was he born with this great knowledge?

It takes time to learn what is best for our country, time and experience.

Hillary 2008

It appears that Obama finally has been "undressed". We now know that he's a liberal elitist.

Time to hang up the empty suit... it's over.

Brian? Sorry to inform you, the POLLS have NOT been RIGHT once, to date.

Your statement that "the polls are always right" is what has caused Obama and his campaign to skid!
THEY follow the polls and believe in them. They fine-tune their campaign based on what the "polls tell them".

While dividing Oregonians is sound politics, this ongoing divisiveness of the Clinton campaign is sickening. I call on fellow Oregonians not to let them capitalize on regional and lifestyle, urban versus rural, division.

Just to add a comment to offset the incorrect statement by the poster "thinking," Obama has enjoyed greater rural support than Clinton in many states. Examples include the earliest state of New Hampshire, where it was the more rural areas that went to Obama while the less rural seacoast went to her, to later states such as Kansas. This isn't even including caucus states.

Its worse than that molly , there are people in media that will destroy the clintons , including chelsea just for having been biologically connected. The hatred is so very deep its frightening that people can stoop as low as they have. Yet they unite under one that stands for the exact opposite of the tactics or so we have been led to believe.

They keep coming up with these new adages like the clinton dynasty, the clinton machine, hoping that one of these will be the "QOUTE" that destroys!

Bill Clinton--or anyone associated with the Clinton campaign for that matter, complaining that some people are saying their votes "don't matter" is laughable.

Especially since Hillary has been the proponent of the "insult 40 states strategy". Caucus voters don't matter; red-state voters don't matter; small state voters don't matter; state with a large African-American population don't matter.

And believe me rural Oregon voters. If your state votes for Barack Obama then YOU won't matter. Voters only matter to the Clinton campaign when they want something from you--your vote.

As soon as they have it; you're forgotten.

This is one of the big difference why Clinton can connect with the core voters of the party than Obama who continues to show his being elitist who only care about the academia and the rich.

When you hear OBAMA denigrating the very good economic record of the only Democratic administration most Americans remember; Bill's presidency in 90s. There is no problem with folks like James Clyburn. But when Bill was resented about the 92% of Black community voting against Hillary, they were upset over Bill's remarks. The black community is entitled to the presidency while rural Americans clings on guns and church because of bitterness. Double standard I call it. Racial discrimination, isn't it?

OBAMA's career has nothing to compare with Bill's and yet there are jeers and sneers from OBAMA.

I felt upset that guys like OBAMA behind a podium promising the moon, and you have no right to question about his past reocrd with dangerous villains and extremists.

Negativity means that you have no right to say anything about a politician who claims to change WASHINGTON while he has never been a factor in Congress or Senate, not of any leadership in bipartisan drive and major causes.

If that is being positive, I find negativity acceptable and safe for the country.

I find OBAMA's positivity hollow and horror-filling because he shall raise the tax by arms and legs.

About half of our voters in Oregon are rural. We only have one really big city and three or four more big enough to have transit systems. Our urban voters tend to favor the moderate to liberal candidates and issues. Our rural voters tend to favor moderate to conservative candidates and issues.

So the former president is right, the rural votes count. And people like it when the candidates/campaigns visit them. Whether or not that translates into votes is something else again.

at first the Clinton's said small and rural states don't matter only big populous states matter. Now they are the rural people's champ is anybody else tired of the lies?

Precisely right, Mr. President.

Look at concentration of technical wealth and ask what can be achieved with superior eduction online to reach rural areas, where the incentive is not no-child-left-behind but no-child-left-unconnected. We can harness the power of the digital social networks to create a revolution in education.

Any rural parent knows this. Mine did. Carter's no-cost college grants gave everyone a chance. Including me.

America is about every American.

The way for the Dems to win the White House is not to trash the only successful Democratic presidency in the last quarter century.

The way to unite the people of this country is not to accuse anyone who does'nt vote for Obama of being a racist (without acknowledging the huge lift he is getting in every state from near universal support from the black community).

The way to unite the Democratic party is not to call Bill Clinton sleazy, Hillary a pathological liar, or to refuse to acknowledge any of their merits. That is the way of a cult - to condemn everyone else and it is no new tone in politics as was promised.

A leader must appreciate the merits in the oposing view point and incorporate them into his own. Obama and his followers continually demean the Clintons and anyone who is voting for her. I need nothing further than that to convince me that his words are just carefully crafted rhetoric.

Obama's message is very appealing, but his actions prove that he doesn't mean any of it. It is a smart tactic, it worked 8 Years ago when George W Bush was selling the exact same line of unity and hope without any real details about what he wanted to do for the country. America bought this bill of goods twice before, maybe they will again, but I for one will continue to vote for the most qualified, competent candidate who has done the most for people of all races over the course of her career - Hillary Clinton.

Tom,

Even Kenneth Star didn't dream up anything that insane. If Obama's supporters now argue that the Clintons are multiple murderers, I guess I can stop wondering why they are voting for him - clearly they have no judgement whatsoever.

Of course the rural areas matter. And Paul Gronke never said they didn't matter. He said that the way of campaigning in the rural areas of Pennsylvania was not going to work here in Oregon. Demographics are different, issues are different, etc. Treating rural areas as if they're all the same state by state is an insult - you can't do it with urban areas and you definitely can't do it with rural areas. Heck, it's hard enough to do it across the entire state. Recognizing that the rural areas in Oregon are different than those in Pennsylvania isn't an insult.

And actually, we have several large cities. There are 4 cities in Oregon larger than 100,000 residents - Portland, Salem, Eugene, and Gresham. There are two cities in the 80-90,000 range (Beaverton and Hillsboro), one in the 70-80,000 range (Medford), and two in the 50-60,000 range (Corvallis and Springfield). In the under 50,000 range: five fall between 30-40,000 (Lake Oswego, Oregon City, Grants Pass, Keizer, and McMinnville), and one falls between 40-50,000 (Tigard).

That's pretty darned good for a state with only 3.7 million people.

And I should say that I grew up in a rural town in Texas and lived there for 22 years before moving to Gresham. I'm not rich - we haven't even been able to afford a house yet. I don't have a college education. I'm a white woman. I've been married for almost 11 years and have a 6 year-old daughter. I've been involved in politics for 18 years and national politics for 16 years. It was actually the 1992 Clinton race that got me involved in national politics.

So please, don't make the assumption that the only ones supporting Obama are rich, elitist, people with college degrees or politically naive young people. It's definitely not true. There are plenty of people like me who don't fit that description.

I hope Professor Paul Gronke responds to his words being twisted. I wish more people would speak up to all this distorting and spinning and misspeaking and, well, just plain old lying that comes out of the Clinton camp.

Enough already! It's insulting and cynical and adds nothing constructive to our discourse.

Just imagine: if we get this much disregard for truth in the primary process, how much abuse of power could we expect from an HRC presidency?

No, thanks. We've been lied to long enough, to disastrous effect. We deserve better.

Celebrities rarely visit small rural towns, providing a way for Bill and basic name recognition to draw a crowd.

Once the cameras are rolling, Bill attacks a straw-man of his own creation... or in this case, Paul Gronke will do.

The political sleight-of-hand here positions multi-millionaires and Washington-insiders Bill and Hillary as defenders of Oregonian rural/less informed and less/educated voters. It's a niche that jumps off the page in PA and Ohio primary results.

This may not work in Oregon, despite the Clintons fervent hopes to parlay this group to offset Obama's popularity in the larger cities.

Rural Oregon are far more informed, able to think in the abstract, and do not appreciate being manipulated by Bill Clinton or any other Eastern "celebrity".

I'm all for having Bill get out there and campaign for Hillary.

Everytime Bill opens his mouth, Obama's popularity goes up a notch.

GS:
The only thing that's over is
Hillary Clinton's campaign!
She Can't Win! Duh!

I was @ Jefferson High School yesterday. Since I am not allowed to vote in the US (US resident - German citizen) I still wanted to see what he has to say. Both democrate candidates are great. Since they have to similar programs in their mind, it will be a "sympathy election". They both have their strenghts and their weaknesses. About the comments here...what's the BS with fighting each side? Both politicians have the chance to win. My opinion and I know a lot of Europeans have the same one:
Hillary should win right now. She has more experience in politics, is a intellegent and strong woman AND she has Bill on her side who already did a good job in being a president. Of course there was the affaire with Monica, but still he did a good job for the American people and outside of the US. Two heads are better than one. Barack, who would be a great president too, should try to run again after he made more experience in politics. Both would be the best choices for you guys.

About yesterday evening there were a few things which sounds kind of interesting what Mr. Clinton brought up. E.g. with the Hybrid cars. I don't really think that you can bring the oil and car industry to go with it. Would be wonderful, but not really realistic - at least not in the next 10 years. We have to change something real quickly. The global warming is present right now. I think Europe did a good thing in putting taxes on cars who have high CO emission. Here are too many SUVs and other big cars on the street. No one really needs such a big private car. Public transportation should be improved. Gas should be more expensive than going with the MAX. Especially here in the States people still have to learn a lot about saving our enviroment.

Interesting debate indeed. I still don't understand how Barack is elitist and Hillary is a good ole gal. They both have Ivy League educations. They both were lawyers. They both have bestselling books that made them lots of money. Both have spouses who are well to do. Neither of them have any problem paying bills. Hillary has a huge house in one of the most upscale/expensive areas in New York State. Barack lives in a nice house in South Side Chicago. If anything they are both walking on rose petals right now. Who's the elitist?

Both of these candidates have been on the ground and listening to the people, but I do think Barack is echoing what people have been telling him in a real world tone. Has he been eloquent in his portrayals? No, but so what. If we as citizens had the intelligence to look deeper than the 30 second news soundbite we would understand what he is saying.

War is sapping the economy. Bad leadership has caused the international reputation of America to plummet. Food prices sky rocket. Jobs are flying across borders. The wealthy are getting more wealthy, the poor more poor, and the middle class is taking on a heavier burden than incomes can handle. People are bitter and pissed off. Obama actually saying it.

Let me translate his words - In difficult times people go to what they know best and gives them relief. When you are stressed you find ways of dealing with that stress. Obama just said plainly and in your face. I think people are so upset with him because he is speaking the truth, and it is hard to hear truth sometimes.

What would you rather have; someone who spins and patronizes you, or someone who tells you the reality?

I actually see things reversed from the commenter, "Tanja." Barack seems to understand that unity is what we need, and real change comes in increments. Hillary's plans are noble, but you can't go from a market health care system to 100% socialized health for every living person overnight. You have to first make it affordable. Get people into the system, then move forward from there. That's just one issue where I believe Barack trumps her.

I think if we bring the level of debate up to the issues and really dissect the issues that will affect our everyday lives we will see what these candidates are truly made of. No more soundbites. No more Reverend Wright videos. No more sniper fire nonsense. Let's get down to business. The voters have to raise the debate and delve deeper than the 30 seconds we see every night on corporate media stations. If you want it you have to work for it. Let's do the work.

God, are we over the Clintons or what?Please, make him stop already, and her!

IT IS OVER Bill and Hillary. The primaries are over. You both know it. It is obvious what your intention is. You are already preparing for 2012 by destroying Obama. Shame on you! And you call yourself a Democrat. It was all along about your ego and you personal goals. I hope the voters in Oregon will teach them a lesson.

The BIGGEST LOOSER of the 2008 elections is going to be BILL CLINTON. There is no doubt about it. This time he will not come back. That for sure. This is United States of America and Clinton Family Bakery. He has lost our respect forever.

Quote: "... actually see things reversed from the commenter, "Tanja." Barack seems to understand that unity is what we need, and real change comes in increments. Hillary's plans are noble, but you can't go from a market health care system to 100% socialized health for every living person overnight. You have to first make it affordable. Get people into the system, then move forward from there. That's just one issue where I believe Barack trumps her. "

Well as far as I understood they don't want it overnight. This subject was also a little bit confusing for me. I am from a country where we have a sozialized health system and the German government struggles a lot with it since our people are getting older and older and our birth rates are very low.

Clinton said that they want to have different health care plans for the people where they can decide which plan they wanna have. Affordable plans for everyone. No one can do this overnight. It's just impossible and I didn't hear this from Mr. Clinton.

What I missed in the speeches of Barrack is how he wants to go with his ideas, with the financing. Hillary and Bill really stepped down and showed exactly how Hillary wants to address these issues with gloabl warming, with the health care system and the financing.

Barrack didn't really do a lot (as far as I read about it) in his position as US senator. I really like Barrack a lot, but like I said he still has to grow with the tasks.

My concerns as a voter would be (since they are so similar in their ideas):
How would the male politicians, especially the conservatives treat Hillary as a woman? Seems conservative men have problems with powerful women. She is strong otherwise she would be there where she is right now, but in the long run it could get difficult.
And on the other side, how would these people work along with a Afro-American?
In one of the democrate debates Hillary struggled a little bit when it got rough during the discussion and instead of going with arguments she started to "shoot" at Obama.

Barrack on the other side - with the lack of experience - could get overruled. He sells himself well, but that's not the "real work" he would have to face.

When I hear people and read these comments here where people are getting real personal about the candidates I like the idea of Barrack to finally work together. America seems to need that. It's hard to have a discussion about politics with the American people, because they didn't get it how to discuss with each other without fighting the other.

One things is sure: You need a change!
Would be great if both could be in charge, but that's just not possible in your way of democracy.

Chillfactor: A lot of us have heard the "speech" before. Obama gets himself in hot water, and instead of facing the press, he gives a "speech." Now, Rev. Wright has been exposed as a racist and anti-American hate monger, and he gives a "speech" to rehabilitate his image. Sorry, chillfactor, many of us are not falling for it. Look at my post below about Rev. Wright's black liberation theology. The very premise upon which it is built is racism against "white people." When Rev. Wright comes forward and rejects the racist theology that he now preaches, maybe then I will react favorably to one of his "speeches."

Truth. It can be a harsh word. When electing a president is not something we hear often. But the fact remains that we as the voters must determine the truth for our selves. We cannot afford to be deceived by lies or propaganda. Every individual must weigh the issues we face as Americans, and choose whom they believe would best meet these issues and guide us down the right path. Don't forget the true issue. What do I want America to mean?

what is the objective here in using "eye dialect" in clinton's quotations ? is it to make him seem like a "down to earth" sort of "fella" (paragraph 12), who would say "oughta" (paragraph 9) and not "ought to" ? so as to appeal to rural oregonians ? if so, that ought to be insulting on both fronts. or is it to make him seem as if he is unintelligent, unlearned, or something along these lines ? either way, or even if it is to be ascribed to carelessness, i think the use of eye dialect here in quotations is inappropriate and the mark of very poor journalism.

What a disturbing pattern. Such hate from people who support the supposed "uniter" candidate. That "uniter" front is just that, a lame front. A "uniter" wins PA when they outspend their opponent 3-1, 11 MILLION dollars! A "uniter" wouldn't rely on historic, record African-American turnout to boost his popular vote. A "uniter" would have locked up the nomination with the tremendous and horrific media bias against Hillary Clinton. A "uniter" would not sit in a church for 20 years listening to divisive hate speech against people of different races/religions. I know if I would have told my Italian friend that Reverend Wright thinks she has a "garlic nose," she wouldn't even consider voting for Obama in the general election, much less a Democratic primary!

Hillary 08'

What a disturbing pattern. Such hate from people who support the supposed "uniter" candidate. That "uniter" front is just that, a lame front. A "uniter" wins PA when they outspend their opponent 3-1, 11 MILLION dollars! A "uniter" wouldn't rely on historic, record African-American turnout to boost his popular vote. A "uniter" would have locked up the nomination with the tremendous and horrific media bias against Hillary Clinton. A "uniter" would not sit in a church for 20 years listening to divisive hate speech against people of different races/religions. I know if I would have told my Italian friend that Reverend Wright thinks she has a "garlic nose," she wouldn't even consider voting for Obama in the general election, much less a Democratic primary!

Hillary 08'

Who has more guts? Who wants to keep the American pride? Who wants to save your young from being torn-apart by road-side explosives and sniper hits? Who wants to give you a safe environment and revived economy? In the paraphrased words of JFK, "who's really thinking of what they can do for the American people and not what America can do for Him/Her"? Hilary or Obama? THINK!