JA, Obama's plan was on his website for 60 days while Graham was still writing McCain's. Obama's plan is simple, change the tax structure to support the middle class. To support increase in middle class wage growth to offset the rises in costs of living.

What is McCain's plan? Please tell me. I've been in these stupid forums for 2 weeks now asking any McCain supporter to present his economic plan and to date, nada. Nothing!

Any way you cut it, McCain's connection to Mr. Whiner is going to be what sinks McTrickdown's campaign.

Republican Herbert Hoover said in 1929 that the economy was essentially strong. Right before the stock market crash and the Great Depression. Now the McCalin team parrots this assessment. Just shows everyone how out-of-touch McCalin team really is.

McCain and Palin remind me of Kermit and Miss Piggy!

On another example of McCain's forgetfulness or just plain broken promises...McCain's people unsuccessfully tried to keep Libertarian Bob Barr off the ballot in PA contrary to promises made by John McCain during his first bid for the presidency after then Texas Governor George Bush tried to have McCain blocked from the New York primary ballot. "I would never consider, ever consider," McCain said during his 2000 campaign, "allowing a supporter of mine to challenge [an opponent's] right to be on the ballot in all 50 states.
"

McCain went on to call such tactics, "Stalinist politics."

Interesting, huh? Give 'em hell, Joe!

Obama/Pelsoi/Biden/Reid 08 Oh yes, that's real change.

If you want to throw the bums out, then throw them all out! Congress is far more to blame than the white house on the economy and none of the candidates are gonna change much.

For YEARS, author and political scientist Kevin Phillips (a Republican, no less)has been predicting the crash that has now started. He points out that when a country's economic system becomes based on speculation instead of manufacturing, it leads inevitably to the country's decline and loss of global dominance. It was true of ancient Rome, Spain, the Netherlands,Great Britain, each in its turn. Our present situation was foreseeable, to anyone who cared to think about it. Instead, the Republican philosophy of deregulation and tax cuts for the wealthy was put forth as a recipe for boosting prosperity. Tragically, many ill-informed voters bought the snake oil, and here we are. We cannot afford to believe McCain's assurances that he now favors regulation of the financial industry and is an agent of change; on the contrary, he has said that he is "fundamentally a deregulator". In my opinion, McCain is fundamentally a cynical pol who will say whatever he needs to get elected. We must not make that mistake.

That said, if Obama is elected, it remains to be seen whether he can turn our economy around. The situation may not be retrievable. I'm confident that he will make his best effort. My greatest fear is that a failure to change conditions quickly will encourage extremist demagogues, leading to election of alternating leftist/rightist administrations, and resulting political instability. This has happened in more countries than I can count, and lives have been lost. I pray that it will not come to this.

Obama is all fluff and no stuff!

Mccain is a proven leader.
Biden is a honorable servant.

, but Obama is irrelevant. No experience. No record. All talk, no action. He is pro abortion and pro gay marriage and he says he is a Christian?

It appears God's laws are more important to John Mccain than his rival
Barack Obama.

Nothing you say here is going to change anyone's opinions. If you wonder why the economy is bad it's because we are all blogging instead of working. Now get back to work!

Most of you are not qualified to vote & need a civics lesson. Read Norman's post to get a clue. We end up in these messes because the majority of the electorate is gullable & ignorant.

Glad to see that Biden made a speech. I was beginning to think he was MIA. Any one considering voting for Obama should take a good long look at his past life - not the life he writes fictitiously about in his books, but his REAL life. Just for openers: Obama says he was never a Muslim. Actually he was registered as a Muslim in Illinois until he was 31 years old. He changed his registration to Catholic at Michelle's insistence so that he could run for office.

Phil Gramm has been on a quest to deregulate the financial industry for decades. How is McCain going to tell people he now believes in regulation when he has taken economic advice from the likes of Gramm?

JA - You need to stop thinking about it as "taxing the rich". Fact: the taxes on the rich during World War I and II were in excess of 80%. At their peak, it was 94%. Now we're fighting a war in Iraq and Bush CUTS TAXES?!

The tax rate of the highest bracket has been declining for decades. The top 20% of America owns 84% of America's wealth. The middle class is about to collapse, and there won't BE anyone to buy the products that the rich people's companies put out.

People who want to vote for McCain obviously don't let little things like FACTS get in their way. It has been shown over and over again that the majority of Republicans vote against their own self interest when they vote republican because in fact most republicans aren't multimillionaires even though that is who the party serves. Getting people to vote against their best interest using FEAR has always been the republican's genius. Look out the commies are coming--Palin can see them up there in Alaska! Look out Obama is a muslim who is going to raise everyone's taxes, a heathen, a baby eater! Somehow it seems to work. And when it doesn't, then voter suppression certainly does.

JA: you asked for real plans...

The federal Office of Management & Budget released their estimates last week of the effects of two economic scenarios.

The first is a continuation of the Bush policies (making the Bush taxes cuts to the highest income brackets permanent, which McCain supports; a $600 billion increase in federal spending, which McCain supports; continuation of war funding assuming troop levels decrease to 30k by 2011). This model shows the annual federal deficit ballooning to $1 TRILLION dollars by 2018. The OMB notes that Bush inherited a budget surplus, but has run annual deficits between $158 billion and $407 billion since then. They also note that the U.S. has accumulated more foreign-held debt during Bush's presidency than was accumulated by ALL PREVIOUS PRESIDENT'S COMBINED (over the course of 224 years). McCain's plans would continue these economic practices and extend the parts that have led to the current problems. Visit their site. Read the report.

The alternative plan is more similar to Obama's plan and shows steady economic gains that begin to dig us out of this deficit-driven hole.

Then again, you'll probably just assert that "facts" have a known "liberal bias" or that the OMB is just using "talking points".

Republicans have short memories. They have controlled the Congress 28 out of the last 28 years and the Presidency for the past 7 1/2 years. And, the Senate is tied at 49-49 among Dems and Repubs. Anyone who has a shred of intelligence would have to put the economic and policy shambles squarely in the hands of the REPUBLICANS and the lobbyists that support them! This country doesn't work without a strong middle class. Republican largess strongly favors the wealthy who aren't suffering.

Norman you must like war or is it pretty fluff? Carl the president can support congress or veto everything that crosses his desk like this one has done that has anything to do with the American people, he even vetoed the bill for the school nutrition program. But what can you do when he is a dictator. Commoin sense with 8 years of seeing nothing but Bagdad what can you expect from this white house.

Sorry Sen. Biden,

Again you sir, are being misleading.

In fact, as you well know, the The Regulatory Oversight Committee who oversee the SEC and regulates Lenders is directly controlled by our 'DEMOCRATIC' Congress.
The Regulators, in fact, turned a "blind eye" away from sub-prime lending practices. Fannie May, Freddie Mack, Lynch, and Leyman all were casualties as a direct result.
Why did the Democratic controlled Regulators allow this 'Flip this house, get rich speculation' out of control sub prime lending fiasco to occur for the last 2 years?
You tell me. In fact mr. Biden, perhaps you should explain to the American People why this committee did not do their job?
Americans are a great deal smarter than you and Obama seem to think we are. So quit trying to 'SPIN US' with misinformation, and disinformation.
It's really insulting for you to think we are all so gullable.
All we have heard from Obama/Biden in the last 30 days are "Wag the Dog" SPIN TACTICS.
This has got to embarrassing to you as well,.. as it is making you look foolish. The Global internet, and technology revolution has made SPIN tactics obsolete. Wake up Joe, it's 2008.
You seem to be a good man at heart Sen. Biden,... don't let Obama's hunger for power destroy your values.

And Mike--how does one register as a Muslim? Are registered as an idiot? Using this same argument one can say McCain was not born in Panama as there is no record of his birth in the Canal Zone Health Department records. Maybe John is lying about where he was born? What is John McCain hiding?

we're a nation of whiners! Why if you make less than $5M you aren't a friend of mine.

What? You don't have an oil well in your back-yard? You're not a friend of mine.

What we need now is a good 'ol picture of Cheney, McSame, Bush, Phil and 'Kenny Boy' from the 'ol days. That is the crux of 'trickle down' economics.

Do you remember the picture of the David ice sculpture at the Enron party? That is what RNC thinks of hard working, lunch pail middle-class Americans.

Why would anyone vote for these people when they do NOT have the best interests of the American people as a priority?

Read these bio's and search for 'deregulation' and there you go. It was not Wall Street, it was the leaders of the elite RNC inner-circle.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phil_Gramm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kenneth_Lay

S. Chambers:

These loan issues did not originate in the last two years. In fact, as others here have noted, the lending practices were allowed as part of what was lauded by republicans in 2002 as a way to stimulate economic growth by increasing consumer spending. They hoped the flexible payment options, low credit requirements, and teaser rates would get people to buy more home than they could afford. Then, equity loans would be a basis for future spending.

The problem is that with a ballooned federal deficit (see my earlier post), which devalued the dollar (also due to spending >$300 million/day in Iraq) and rising unemployment, banks adjusted those mortgage rates substantially upward. The problem snowballed when loan defaults portended increased risk on those predatory loans and banks priced that risk into the rates. In short, the problem began to manifest noticably in late summer 2007, because those lax restrictions established in late 2001 and early 2002 (in an attempt to spur the economy) started to come due - in the form of ARMs that hit their initial adjustments after 5 years. The risk was just never priced into the mortgage-backed securities (and banks drastically over-estimated repayments, partly because they underestimated the damage this administration would do to the larger economy).

We're paying the piper for the financial deregulation and lax standards introduced in 2002 and the poor economic policies of the past 7 years. (Exactly what fanciful mortgage securities model convinced you to think that such a thing started in the last 2 years???)

Most economic models suggest that we can continue to expect declines as we continue to see the effects of those poor lending practices. The national housing market might decline another 10-15% through late 2010 and will likely level off then. Look for mortgage rates roughly to approximate area rental prices as a sign of a deflated "bubble".

Does that help?

P.S. Your misspellings of the names of Freddie Mac, Fannie Mae, & Lehman make me wonder how much you've read about these issues. Also, what does "gullable" mean?